This shit ain't right...

@room101


In a free society, every citizen has equal power. A power salute gesture is a proclamation of greater power for the one raising their hand.

@Heartlander As per usual, you have no clue.............about anything!

@room101

Saluting with an open hand is a non-threatening gesture of acknowledgment and respect. With a closed fist it's about grabbing power by whatever means available.

@Heartlander NO it does not. Not even a little bit.

The fact that you see a raised fist as a threat is not surprising in the slightest. Neither is your puerile attempt to redefine its meaning.

@room101 I hear what you're saying but I have a different take. Maybe it was the smug grin on her face as she was being escorted away. That was a made for Twitter show as I see it. Her hands were behind her back for a reason and it wasn't to comply with an order that was given. As is often the case with her and the other "I want it now" Progressive representatives, she made it about herself rather than the issue. I mean, people are talking about her and not the protest, right? She can't help herself. Never met a camera she didn't like as long as grievance is the message.

@room101

@Ynotisay Maybe, because I'm not American and not constantly subjected to endless speculation and interpretation of motives etc, I just don't see her that way.

To me, she is passionate about her social beliefs and expresses herself as such. Does she court attention? Why wouldn't she if that's what is required to get her message across given the way America operates.

I'm sorry but Americans revel in celebrity and media coverage. Why wouldn't she know this and use it accordingly? Especially when one considers the flak that is hurled her way every damned day.

@Heartlander And your silly meme means what exactly?

Oh no, it's those Red's under the Bed's coming to get you. McCarthy really did a number on you morons didn't he😂😂😂

@Ynotisay
I'm not sure grievance is particularly significant here, as much as seeking attention and showmanship, tbh.

AOC happens to be a progressive, but this little scene strikes me as only slightly less histrionic and juvenile than GOP folks marching down to the basement, Gaetz wearing a gas mask, etc.

Honestly, she's great with tweets and smart aleck responses, but stuff like this keeps her from getting to the next level, imo. That may be for the best in her case, but I really think we need to somehow get past the photo op crap, chopper talk, and start expecting more from Congress people than just making a show out of "representing us."

AOC is dancing with Boebert and MTG, imo, when she seems capable of much more.

@room101 I don't think there's any question that she's passionate. But that doesn't transfer to effectiveness as a politician. She's a community activist. That's her lane. She sees all attention as good attention. I mean, she went to the Met Gala, which is ALL about privilege, wearing a dress that said "Tax the Rich." It was juvenile and tone deaf. I happen to agree with many of the issues and stances she promotes. But I think in many ways she does more harm than good. It appeals to younger people who don't understand the machinations of grown up politics. Much like Bernie Sanders, who is a wildly ineffective lawmaker, it's about selling a "magic wand" that doesn't exist to impressionable people. The issues themselves get lost in the shuffle because they're not approached with sober, realistic thinking. Just my take as an American.

@MistyCee With all due respect, almost every time I go to any American political news forum, all I see are countless assertions of how much this or that candidate has raised in campaign funds. And, countless campaign ads by said politicians.

Why do your politicians need so much money to get elected? Answer, to pay for their much needed ads.

If AOC can do this by simply putting herself where news cameras are clearly going to be, why wouldn't she?

To me, this is very much a case of "don't blame the player, blame the game".

@MistyCee Totally agree. Irrespective of what side of the fence they're on, the far left and far right have similarities. It's about emotion and appealing to fear and anger. It doesn't push the ball down the field towards legislative change. I don't think that's the goal.

@Ynotisay In many ways, I agree with you. Particularly vis-a-vis effectiveness. But I have to reiterate what I said to @MistyCee above:

don't blame the player, blame the game

@MistyCee Her photo-ops are their to help her supportive media elevate her leadership status among malcontent leftist. It's like the tree falling in the forest thing.

For the rest of us, though, it makes a good case for not voting Democrat knowing that she comes with the package,

@Heartlander Wtf did you just say?
Did you really expect me to reply to it?

@Heartlander Yeah, it's so much better to go with this package instead😂😂😂

@MistyCee

:) I could care less whether you replied to it or not.

AOC is the symbolic leader of malcontent leftist and the leftist media have to help her hoist her flag.

@Heartlander
So why did you tag me?

@room101 :) You and the rest of the WOKE pack seem to be far too absorbed in hating Trump. The result of that hatred being $5 gas, 10% inflation, out of control crime in all the big Democrat cities, and a few dozen other miseries inflicted on the American people.

For us non-WOKES, for the Democrats to surrender more of their leadership to AOC the result would likely be $10 a gallon gas, 20% inflation, and crime so high that we would seek safety in Mexico.

@MistyCee

:) I commented on the article you referenced with my interpretation of what AOC was up to. You were but the mailman who delivered that article.

@Heartlander “Woke pack” oh my Lord STOP, please just STOP. Your fathomless ignorance is, quite frankly, exhausting.

You seem like a well-meaning and relatively genuine guy. It’s also abundantly clear that you have some long held beliefs and opinions. Nothing wrong with that, we all do it. However, there comes a time when we need to hit the pause button on our beliefs and opinions and examine them in an objective and empirically provable way.

The power salute has been used for decades, if not centuries. There are depictions of it in paintings of the French Revolution, it was used by the suffragettes, it was used by black American athletes in the 1968 Olympic games. It means one thing and one thing only, the unity of the oppressed against their oppressors. If you can dismiss that history as being “woke” then the examination of your beliefs and opinions is very overdue.

“Saluting with an open hand is a non-threatening gesture of acknowledgment and respect. With a closed fist it's about grabbing power by whatever means available.”

If you believe that this is threatening:


But believe that this is not:



Then your self-examination is long, long, long overdue.

@room101

:) you are trying too hard.

Those hail Caesar, heil Hitler type gestures weren't salutes but gestures of homage and submission to totalitarian leaders. "Misleaders" would be a better word. They are gestures of solidarity. Very different from the closed fist which is one of defiance.

Taking a few steps backwards on this discussion, I think it worth drawing comparisons between the US WOKE pack and their Communist brothers and sisters in places like China, Russia, North Korea; or even places like Iran, Afghanistan, etc.

Such protests would very possibly lead to long prison sentences or even death sentences in some of those places. And even what they were protesting about. In those totalitarian countries, the government exercises considerable control and authority over reproduction.

@Heartlander And you're not trying hard enough. You say something (which I've replicated for you) but then seemingly try to say that you meant something else.

The fact is that the open hand sieg heil salute has a very specific meaning, as does the closed fist salute. As does the abuse of the word "woke".

But you know what, all of this is a mildly entertaining distraction. The point of this discussion is twofold.

First, was AOC (and the other 16 democratically elected representatives) arrested for exercising their First Amendment rights available to every US citizen? Your viewpoint seems to be about pavements and doors and the ridiculous whataboutism vis-a-vis what would have happened to them in other authoritarian regimes. Which is what you and others of your ilk seem to be punting for.

Second, was this all a stunt for the cameras?

The answer to the first point/question is a resounding YES!

For the second point, I suggest you scroll through this discussion and avail yourself of my replies to @MistyCee and @Ynotisay. Which can be summarised thus:

"Don't blame the player, blame the game."