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IronHamster · 56-60, M
@Lostpoet I'm not offended by that cultural appropriation thing, as long as you show up on time, pay your child support, and don't drag me into small claims court.
marciamom · F
@Torsten It is the opposite of my point. Your media exposure is left-leaning. If you had a healthy balance of information and knew both sides, you may decide one way or the other. But knowing only one side, your decision is easy, if lacking in nuance. Don't forget that nearly 75,000,000 people voted for Trump in the last election. You could write them off as 75,000,000 idiots. Or maybe there is more here than your media is telling you.
SomeMichGuy · M
@marciamom
No, I think that they were mostly misled by the easy lies, rather than accepting harder truths.
It's out of THOSE people that the QAnonsense, ivermectin, "natural immunity", etc., etc., etc., come.
Don't forget that nearly 75,000,000 people voted for Trump in the last election. You could write them off as 75,000,000 idiots.
No, I think that they were mostly misled by the easy lies, rather than accepting harder truths.
It's out of THOSE people that the QAnonsense, ivermectin, "natural immunity", etc., etc., etc., come.
marciamom · F
@SomeMichGuy Each side has it whackos and sometimes, they speak the loudest. "Defund the police" and the notion of burning cities down in the name of BLM comes from Biden's voters but that doesn't mean that a significant number of people think that is a good idea.
SomeMichGuy · M
@marciamom Lol
"Defund the police" was about re-funding mental health places, etc., which all got shoved onto the police as the authority of last resort.
Of course, some people are also fed up with how our police, who used to throw water on fires, now, all too often, seem to bring gasoline...and want to use the military tools they were given, instead of trying to stop things before they get bad...you know, Sheriff Andy Taylor-like, rather than killing people as they run away from a traffic stop, claiming they were "afraid"...or reaching for a taser but firing a gun...
The BLM things were not uniformly violent, and some investigative repirting turned up right-wing provacateurs as instigators.
But no rational person on either side should condone either protest-related violence or an insurrection.
"Defund the police" was about re-funding mental health places, etc., which all got shoved onto the police as the authority of last resort.
Of course, some people are also fed up with how our police, who used to throw water on fires, now, all too often, seem to bring gasoline...and want to use the military tools they were given, instead of trying to stop things before they get bad...you know, Sheriff Andy Taylor-like, rather than killing people as they run away from a traffic stop, claiming they were "afraid"...or reaching for a taser but firing a gun...
The BLM things were not uniformly violent, and some investigative repirting turned up right-wing provacateurs as instigators.
But no rational person on either side should condone either protest-related violence or an insurrection.
marciamom · F
@SomeMichGuy Correct - that is my point. That there are many nuts on both sides. But to say that the people who stormed the capital comes from the 75,000,000 Trump voters, which is technically true, is not more interesting than saying that they come from the 280,000,000 Americans. They don't reflect on anyone but themselves.
dakotaviper · 56-60, M
@marciamom funny how you describe 75 million people as being idiots. That means 81 million people were extremely stupid idiots.
SomeMichGuy · M
@marciamom
If I were a supporter of Trump, I guess I'd (now) try to distance myself from those people, too.
But NO, they were NOT just of 280 million Americans (I'm not sure what you are conveying here; the population is more like 330 million, prior to the poorly executed census), as they were not from all parts of the political spectrum.
They were Trump supporters trying to make their man an extra-Constitutional leader. That's what happens in banana republics.
They were misled by the *only* President in history who refused to accept the vote and how it shaped the Electoral College. (And who *continues* to rant about the 2 & 3 rd national elections he lost.)
It IS germane that they come from the party which used to be conservative in a traditional sense.
If it had been a Democratic President who had lied and asked people to come to WDC on the date of the counting of the Electoral Votes, and liberal supporters had broken into our shared national property, and had attacked / assaulted the resident security force, and had gone with wrist zip ties, looking for members of Congress, and had erected a gallows for hanging the liberal VP, in an attack after which a number of liberal politicians would ask for pardons for their own actions...
If all of THAT had occurred, would Republicans say that being Democrats was just a happenstance?
Give me a break.
But to say that the people who stormed the capital comes from the 75,000,000 Trump voters, which is technically true, is not more interesting than saying that they come from the 280,000,000 Americans. They don't reflect on anyone but themselves.
If I were a supporter of Trump, I guess I'd (now) try to distance myself from those people, too.
But NO, they were NOT just of 280 million Americans (I'm not sure what you are conveying here; the population is more like 330 million, prior to the poorly executed census), as they were not from all parts of the political spectrum.
They were Trump supporters trying to make their man an extra-Constitutional leader. That's what happens in banana republics.
They were misled by the *only* President in history who refused to accept the vote and how it shaped the Electoral College. (And who *continues* to rant about the 2 & 3 rd national elections he lost.)
It IS germane that they come from the party which used to be conservative in a traditional sense.
If it had been a Democratic President who had lied and asked people to come to WDC on the date of the counting of the Electoral Votes, and liberal supporters had broken into our shared national property, and had attacked / assaulted the resident security force, and had gone with wrist zip ties, looking for members of Congress, and had erected a gallows for hanging the liberal VP, in an attack after which a number of liberal politicians would ask for pardons for their own actions...
If all of THAT had occurred, would Republicans say that being Democrats was just a happenstance?
Give me a break.
SomeMichGuy · M
@marciamom
They were morons, perhaps but Trump supporters, surely.
And your numbers are a tad off...over 800 people have been arrested.
couple, few, several... this is at least several hundred...
For every answer to a poll, a given respondent represents some set of others not polled. It should bother you that Trump's followers are fanatical enough to raise that many people to travel to the Capitol, and that so many went prepared for actual armed conflict, with C^3 capabilities, and that they actually BREACHED the Capitol, and some went looking for members of Congress (with wrist zip ties) and some even erected a gallows and threatened to hang the VP.
Those were insurrectionists on the Right.
That should make you realize that a habitually-lying narcissist is fundamentally unfit for the office of President.
And remember, it was a REPUBLICAN President who called forth his minions, morons or not, to do just this.
Not a Democratic President, a REPUBLICAN President.
Where?
Who was actively trying to destroy our country on 6 Jan. 2021? A REPUBLICAN President and a REPUBLICAN mob os insurrectionists.
Get real, lady.
"they were trump supporters?"
They were a few hundred morons.
They were a few hundred morons.
They were morons, perhaps but Trump supporters, surely.
And your numbers are a tad off...over 800 people have been arrested.
couple, few, several... this is at least several hundred...
Among Trump supporters, they were not statistically significant.
For every answer to a poll, a given respondent represents some set of others not polled. It should bother you that Trump's followers are fanatical enough to raise that many people to travel to the Capitol, and that so many went prepared for actual armed conflict, with C^3 capabilities, and that they actually BREACHED the Capitol, and some went looking for members of Congress (with wrist zip ties) and some even erected a gallows and threatened to hang the VP.
Those were insurrectionists on the Right.
That should make you realize that a habitually-lying narcissist is fundamentally unfit for the office of President.
And remember, it was a REPUBLICAN President who called forth his minions, morons or not, to do just this.
Not a Democratic President, a REPUBLICAN President.
Political violence is much more mainstream in the left than the right
Where?
Who was actively trying to destroy our country on 6 Jan. 2021? A REPUBLICAN President and a REPUBLICAN mob os insurrectionists.
Get real, lady.
marciamom · F
@SomeMichGuy BLM riots resulted in nearly $2 BILLION in damages and over 14,000 arrests. You think 800 drunks were going to take down the country? Where were you when this was going on?
SomeMichGuy · M
@marciamom
I saw people who were very passionate about their cause, I don't know how you are able to do a visual blood alcohol level assessment and write them off, though saying that they were "drunk" and "morons" is a good way to "other" them.
Q1- HAD they succeeded, would you have been happy?
These "drunks" / "morons" DID
• push down barricades;
• assault various Capitol police officers and othere who were supposed to be there;
• break into the US Capitol at multiple points;
• force Congress to stop its Constitutionally-mandated proceedings regarding the Presidential election;
• force members of Congress to flee from, evacuate, hide in, etc., the US Capitol and connected buildings;
and some
• went with obvious malice aforethought,
• threatened to hang the VP at a gallows constructed on the Capitol grounds.
Q2-When were these things done by Democratic insurrectionists?
Why are you so unwilling to accept that
• a Republican President is even now resisting the orderly transfer of power from the last election?
• he, a Republican President, schemed to destroy the Constitition and abandon his oath fir the sake of power & adulation?
• he, a Republican President, asked the insurrectionists to come to WDC, and told some set of them to go fight hard...?
• the Republican insurrectionists attempted to do Trump's bidding?
These are painted with your color...and the blood of those who died as a result of this treason.
And of course protests should be non-violent, incl. destruction of private property. I'll look more into that. It's horrific from either side.
You think 800 drunks were going to take down the country?
I saw people who were very passionate about their cause, I don't know how you are able to do a visual blood alcohol level assessment and write them off, though saying that they were "drunk" and "morons" is a good way to "other" them.
Q1- HAD they succeeded, would you have been happy?
These "drunks" / "morons" DID
• push down barricades;
• assault various Capitol police officers and othere who were supposed to be there;
• break into the US Capitol at multiple points;
• force Congress to stop its Constitutionally-mandated proceedings regarding the Presidential election;
• force members of Congress to flee from, evacuate, hide in, etc., the US Capitol and connected buildings;
and some
• went with obvious malice aforethought,
• threatened to hang the VP at a gallows constructed on the Capitol grounds.
Q2-When were these things done by Democratic insurrectionists?
Why are you so unwilling to accept that
• a Republican President is even now resisting the orderly transfer of power from the last election?
• he, a Republican President, schemed to destroy the Constitition and abandon his oath fir the sake of power & adulation?
• he, a Republican President, asked the insurrectionists to come to WDC, and told some set of them to go fight hard...?
• the Republican insurrectionists attempted to do Trump's bidding?
These are painted with your color...and the blood of those who died as a result of this treason.
And of course protests should be non-violent, incl. destruction of private property. I'll look more into that. It's horrific from either side.
IronHamster · 56-60, M
@SomeMichGuy Tjose things were not done by a Republican President.
Obama used the IRS as a political weapon against his opponents.
Biden is using the FBI as a political weapon.
So...
Obama used the IRS as a political weapon against his opponents.
Biden is using the FBI as a political weapon.
So...
SomeMichGuy · M
@IronHamster
No.
Every one of the items was done by Donald Trump, the last Republican President.
...Lord willing.
Tjose things were not done by a Republican President.
No.
Every one of the items was done by Donald Trump, the last Republican President.
...Lord willing.
IronHamster · 56-60, M
@SomeMichGuy Lol. You are a liar. Cite evidence.
SomeMichGuy · M
@IronHamster The evidence for items 2-4 is again being presented in televised hearings. Republicans who were in the room/on the phone with him, are testifying about Trump's words, actions, an inactions.
For item 1, Trump STILL refuses to accept that he lost both the popular AND the electoral vote in the 2020 election, and he has come out making these statements again in the past month.
If you don't pay attention to the news about these crucial events, go waste someone else's time.
For item 1, Trump STILL refuses to accept that he lost both the popular AND the electoral vote in the 2020 election, and he has come out making these statements again in the past month.
If you don't pay attention to the news about these crucial events, go waste someone else's time.
IronHamster · 56-60, M
@SomeMichGuy Trump didn't lose. You are not being presented with one side of the evidence.
There are dozens of prominent Democrats that insist Trump did not win in 2016, but they never presented any evidence at all. What do we do with all of them? How about the movement that still today gives them a platform to speak?
There are dozens of prominent Democrats that insist Trump did not win in 2016, but they never presented any evidence at all. What do we do with all of them? How about the movement that still today gives them a platform to speak?
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