I really would like to debate a conservative GOP as to what you guys would like to see happen in our country.

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walt82 · 80-89, M

This is my first posting. Please, let's stop the schoolyard insults and try to seriously discuss the issues raised by the original question "I really would like to debate a conservative GOP as to what you guys would like to see happen in our country". I'm an old guy who is totally politically unaffiliated so I don't have a dog in the fight. But, as an American citizen, I need to understand what all this bickering is about. The Left seems to have a long list of goals they would like to attain but their constituents are so varied they can't seem to agree on anything. But at least they have an agenda. On the other hand, the Right has yet to articulate what they want. They feel greatly aggrieved but can't seem to point to anything tangible as the source of their grievance.

It seems as though Republicans' pet peeve is that the 2020 election was "stolen" - what does that even mean? There is not a single piece of evidence of voter fraud that hasn't been discredited, yet the wailing still continues.
So come on guys, explain to us exactly what has got you so wound-up.

I hope some of you more serious conservative forum members take the time to write in and offer your facts and opinions to make your case on your side of the debate without name-calling or offering Qanon and Fox News quotes as proof of Liberal wrong-doing. Such strong feelings have to have some basis in fact, so please enlighten us.

Strictgram · 70-79, C

@walt82 Politically unaffiliated? Nonsense I know a leftist old fart when I see one.

Vin53 · M

Most cons are convinced that the 2020 election wasn't the fairest election this country has ever had, despite reports that it was. So what is your right-wing nut job take?

@Strictgram

BohemianBoo · M

@walt82 [quote]The Left seems to have a long list of goals they would like to attain but their constituents are so varied they can't seem to agree on anything.[/quote]

The reason for that is because the Democratic Party is made up of Conservatives, Liberals, and Leftists. They're broadly called "The Left" because they're to the Left of the Republicans. But really, there's no single ideology for the Democrats.

As for the Republicans, they're pretty consistently Fascists. But because their policies are unpopular with most Americans, they need to talk about nonsense culture war bullshit.

walt82 · 80-89, M

@Strictgram You're right, I do lean more toward the Dems even though I'm a registered independent voter. Even though the Democratic party's platform is a mish-mosh of competing policies, they at least have policies. The Republican platform seems to be a collection of unsubstantiated grievances - for example, immigration. They are up-in-arms about 'those people' coming here taking our jobs. They ignore the fact these people work hard at jobs that Americans refuse to do. Who do you think cuts our lawns, works in our sweatshops, cleans our homes and offices.? Have we forgotten who originally built our railroads, steel mills, etc? But the Republicans have chosen to vilify these people because they're easy targets and can't fight back.

"@walt82 Politically unaffiliated? Nonsense I know a leftist old fart when I see one." Wow, that really hurt - calling me a left-leaning but well-informed octagenarian would have been much more appropriate.

walt82 · 80-89, M

@Strictgram If your acuity is so advanced that you can 'see' through the internet, what am I wearing?

Strictgram · 70-79, C

@BohemianBoo Come back when you grow up.

Strictgram · 70-79, C

@walt82 So you support uncontrolled open borders because it provides cheap labor? That makes you ill informed not well informed. Do you understand that along with some hard working illegals there are criminals. terrorists, drug smugglers and sex traffickers?

walt82 · 80-89, M

@Strictgram No one said anything about uncontrolled open borders, only that shutting down immigration at the southern border would do serious damage to our economy - imagine what a head of lettuce would cost you if it was picked by people earning $15 per hour. Talk about ill-informed, do you understand that most immigrants are good people fleeing horrendous living conditions beyond our ability to comprehend - many are fleeing out of fear of being murdered. Of course, a few bad apples will slip in but on a per-capita basis not nearly as many as fear mongers such as yourself would suggest.

Strictgram · 70-79, C

@walt82 Do you understand the difference between legal and illegal immigration? No one has suggested that guest workers not be allowed in to work on farms. You're badly informed if you don't recognize the dangers that open borders present.

walt82 · 80-89, M

@Strictgram @Strictgram Do you understand that a guest worker is not an immigrant? Guest workers come here with the understanding that they will eventually return to their native country. Immigrants are seeking sanctuary, they cannot go back for all the reasons already discussed. The Right has attempted to paint all immigrants with the same broad brush of being terrorists, etc, etc. They are not. Most of them, legal and illegal, are looking for a safe place, period. We apparently agree on one thing, border security is important and it must be improved. But never again as it was handled during the previous administration. (we probably don't agree on that last sentence, huh?)