Where's the decency?

@Scooter Only when used as a point of argument

@Jackaloftheazuresand still works as it is still being used be belittle the opposition’s argument

@Scooter If I just walk up to you out of the blue and call you a drunk and you were in fact being a drunk that is not a debate and it would be true

@Scooter And also even Wikipedia says this so

"An ad hominem should not be confused with an insult"

@Jackaloftheazuresand you’re presenting a false equivalency. The context is the insult being used in place of a proper rebuttal, which would take place in a debate

@Jackaloftheazuresand as in it shouldn’t be confused as synonymous. An insult can still be used in a similar way to ad hominem

@Scooter It can but it isn't which is what you first said

@Jackaloftheazuresand the grammar of that slightly confuses me on what you mean. I was speaking in the context she brought up, which I didn’t directly state as I thought the context would be obvious as it is dirived from the initial post

@Scooter I know it confuses you, I chose you because I'm tired of logic and reasoning 101. When pointing to fallacies within an argument is conducted by one of the participants it is in itself fallacious. That is the duty of a moderator, you even brought one up in the false equivalence as I knew you would.

@Jackaloftheazuresand The point of debate is to show the issues of the opposition’s argument. Using a premade word for it is acceptable. How is identifying fallacies by a debater fallacious?

@Scooter because it does not refute the point to state such

@Jackaloftheazuresand yes it does. If a point is built upon a logical fallacy it is not valid because, as the term’s name suggest, it is not based failed logic. If this was not the case, there would be no reason for any one to call out logical fallacies be them debaters or moderater.

@Scooter you end up explaining the fallacy when you call it out anyway so tell me what the point is of specifically naming it.

Your moderator would call it out in something like a straw man much like a judge would call to the record keeper or the jury

@Jackaloftheazuresand you explain how it fits the fallacy yes, but without that fallacy already being understood, then connecting it to the fallacy is pointless. What better way to call upon the understanding of a term than to use its name? It’s like needing to use the word simile when talking about a comparison using like or as made by an author in an English class essay.

I don’t quite understand your connection. In what way is calling out a logical mistake the same as calling upon someone else who is helping a trail go on?

@Scooter Explaining the fallacy is understanding it and conveying it, naming it is something else. Now this is conjecture on my part I'm aware but I think people name fallacies because they are weaponizing them. You don't have to tell me I said this or that specific fallacy to explain why I'm wrong because that's what the explanation is for.

That is because the judge will say something like "strike that from the record" or "the jury is to disregard those statements." If the mod spots a fallacy in such a case as I set they would say "strawman, reformulate" or "ad hominem, retract." It is meant to keep participants in line.

@Jackaloftheazuresand simply put, naming a fallacy and connecting what you believe falls under it is far more efficient than fully explaining a fallacy every time you run into it. When you name it you are also appealing to the fact that you are going by the pretty universal idea that logic that falls under a logical fallacy is incorrect, which can strengthen the debunking. As far as weaponizing goes, people do that with all debating tactics sadly.

Now that you gave examples, the connection is clearer. Thank you for that. I still don’t agree that a debater shouldn’t name the fallacy in question, but I see how the connection works. This is expecially the case because not all debates have moderaters (I still believe that you should name them when there is, but it’s even more so the case when there isn’t a moderater)