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Proof that Trump lost the debate

Remember two and a half months ago (has it only been that long?) when Biden lost the debate against Trump? The reason we knew he lost was because Democrats were saying it. There were also excuses for his poor performance, like "he had a cold," but the main discussion was about replacing him at the top of the ticket. I don't remember anyone saying he won. There were a few articles about how if you ignored his weak, barely audible delivery and awkward pauses, and focused on his actual words, he was very detailed in contrast with Trump's bombast and fire hose of lies. But overall, Democrats were admitting he lost.

The same thing is happening now on the Republican side. Of course, the hard-core MAGAs are saying Trump won, but he could have pulled his pants down and taken a dump right on stage and they'd still say he won. But outside the cult, they're admitting he lost. The proof is that they're giving excuses for his performance, like "the moderators were biased" or "Harris got the questions in advance" or my favorite, "Harris' earrings were actually earbuds and someone was feeding her the answers" (maybe Pete Buttigieg or Barack Obama?). No one ever makes excuses for the winner, just the loser. Even Trump knows he lost, because he felt the need to come out right after and handle the spin himself. His excuse was that the moderators fact-checked him, but not Harris. Of course, she didn't say anything as outrageous as Haitian immigrants are eating the fine house pets of Ohio, a meme currently making its way around the right-wing internet, and one JD Vance is doubling down on.

Whether this debate moves the needle at all remains to be seen. Winning a debate isn't winning an election. Electoral-vote.com has a summary here:

https://www.electoral-vote.com/evp2024/Items/Sep12-1.html
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Great post! Yes, the right-wing weirdness in the wake of the debate certainly tells a tale, does it not?
Northwest · M
From one of my comments yesterday:

When the Democrats saw that there's an issue with the candidate, they asked him to step aside. When "Conservatives" are faced with a logical decision, they punt and pick party over country.
ShadowSister · 51-55, F
I don't understand the "undecided" voters. I understand why someone might leery towards Harris. Let's say someone doesn't agree with her policies. Okay, most of us don't. I certainly have my issues with her. So for the sake of argument, let's concede that she's a bad candidate. If so, she's bad like junk food.

Her opponent is bad like cyanide.

Why is this even still something we are having a national conversation about?
@emiliya I read Project 2025. It's just as bad as they say it is. At least you admit that Trump is only claiming to not support it because it's become toxic, not because he doesn't actually support it. Some of its proposals aren't practical as they would require a constitutional amendment. Others would require the Republicans to control not just the presidency, but both houses of Congress. Other proposals, like destroying the federal government by replacing knowledgeable employees with Heritage Foundation lackeys, could be implemented by the President alone.

I'm glad you can't vote in our elections. You're entitled to your opinion as to which American policies would be better for you in your country. The US economy is so large, it affects the entire world. A depression in the US would lead to a worldwide depression. Aside from the harm Project 2025 would inflict on Americans in their daily lives (through lack of regulation and making the government ineffective), by tanking the economy, it would have a bad effect on people in other countries. May I ask what country you're in?
emiliya · 22-25, F
@LeopoldBloom I am from southwest Russia, but I am living in UK. All governments are dictatorial in nature, to varying degrees. I do not think being run by a large group of dictators is better than one or a few dictators in government. It seems we have come to think that more people making decisions means more freedom.

What do you think is bad about Project 25? Why would Trump damage global economies? He wants America to be rich and successful.

Which proposals would require constitutional amendments?
@emiliya Here's a list of some of the things Project 2025 would do, with page references. I consider every one of these to be harmful. Since Trump and Vance plan to implement Project 2025, I can't support him (aside from him being a convicted felon, along with facing charges for attempting to overturn a lawful election, and very likely having raped dozens of women and children). I also approve of how President Biden has done his job and think Vice-President Harris will continue the same policies, so I plan to vote for her for that reason.

Of course, if you support Project 2025, then I guess you should support Trump.


Maybe you can tell me what you see on here that you like.
thisguy20 · 41-45, M
SUPER-WEIRD jd THE COUCH-MAN vance is from Ohio...maybe its him and/or his family of immigrants (see his mail-order bride and her chain-immigration relatives) who are eating those pets, which would explain how he knows about it happening
1234cardiff · 61-69, M
%100 right
What worries me is ( if the count is hacked and unbelievable he's win again against all odds and poles. If he loses u s a could have another civil war.

He has such a dictatorship creative mind and pregidest to immigrate
( born in America make you American )
God help and bless American lives and life style
Republican Karl Rove says Trump got ‘crushed by a woman he called dumb as a rock’ during ‘train wreck’ debate

Veteran Republican strategist says Trump’s ‘furious’ performance ‘catastrophic’ whereas Harris was ‘calm, confident, strong and focused on the future’


Source: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-harris-debate-karl-rove-verdict-b2611340.html

Writing in The Wall Street Journal, Rove says the former president’s performance was “far worse than anything Team Trump could have imagined” and Trump was “visibly rattled” as Harris “launched rocket after rocket at him.”

. . .

Going deeper, Rove writes that Trump was bested by his emotions when he must have known Harris would try and get him to lose his cool.

“He took the bait almost every time she put it on the hook, offering a pained smile as she did,” Rove said. “Rather than dismissing her attacks and launching his strongest counterarguments against her, Mr Trump got furious.”

. . .

Offering his opinion of Trump’s demeanor, Rove says: “It matters how debating candidates carry themselves. There, it was no contest. Ms Harris came across as calm, confident, strong and focused on the future. Mr Trump came across as hot, angry and fixated on the past, especially his own.”

. . .

“But there’s no putting lipstick on this pig,” says Rove. “Mr Trump was crushed by a woman he previously dismissed as ‘dumb as a rock’. Which raises the question: What does that make him?”
JollyRoger · 70-79, M
@trollslayer Great analysis! To me it shows that rich people see 'money' on his coat-tails and know that what he plans to do will benefit them too. As for the famous ones - take a look at the number of movie-types and music-makers who distance themselves from him. And, yes... there are some who don't.
JimboSaturn · 56-60, M
Excellent compare and contrast!

 
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