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ChipmunkErnie · 70-79, M
'One of the first actions that the Italian government took against Italian Jews began in 1938 with the enactment of the Racial Laws of segregation by the fascist regime of Benito Mussolini. These laws stripped away many basic human rights of the Italian Jewish citizens, with Jewish children not being allowed to go to school and Jews forbidden from marrying outside their cultural heritage. Before the Italian surrender in 1943, however, Italy and the Italian occupation zones in Greece, France and Yugoslavia had comparatively been places of relative safety for local Jews and European Jewish refugees. This changed in September 1943, when German forces occupied the country, installed the puppet state of the Italian Social Republic and immediately began persecuting and deporting the Jews found there. Of the population of 38,994 Italian Jews, 7,172 were arrested and became victims of the Holocaust. By the war's end, 31,822 Jews remained in the country, having managed to evade deportation while remaining in Italy. The Italian police and Fascist militia played an integral role as the Germans' accessories.
While most Italian concentration camps were police and transit camps, one camp, the Risiera di San Sabba in Trieste, was also an extermination camp. It is estimated that up to 5,000 political prisoners were murdered there. More than 10,000 political prisoners and 40,000–50,000 captured Italian soldiers were interned and killed overall.'
Another forgotten part of Fascist war crimes is the "pacification" of Libya and the invasion of Ethiopia. Just a sample...
'In 1911, Italy went to war with the Ottoman Empire and invaded Ottoman Tripolitania. One of the most notorious incidents during this conflict was the October Tripoli massacre, wherein an estimated 4,000 inhabitants of the Mechiya oasis were killed as retribution for the execution and mutilation of Italian captives taken in an ambush at nearby Sciara Sciat. Over the course of three days, Libyan and Turkish men, women, and children were indiscriminately murdered in the streets, in their houses, farms, and gardens. Libyan and Turkish women were also reportedly raped and sexually assaulted by Italian troops, prompting ferocious and violent retaliation against captured Italian troops by Ottoman soldiers.[1] In another incident during the war reported by a British officer serving with the Turkish forces, Italian soldiers burned several hundred civilians in a mosque, wherein women and children had taken refuge. In 1912, 10,000 Turkish and Arab troops were imprisoned in concentration camps in Libya, and all Turkish troops were executed.'
While most Italian concentration camps were police and transit camps, one camp, the Risiera di San Sabba in Trieste, was also an extermination camp. It is estimated that up to 5,000 political prisoners were murdered there. More than 10,000 political prisoners and 40,000–50,000 captured Italian soldiers were interned and killed overall.'
Another forgotten part of Fascist war crimes is the "pacification" of Libya and the invasion of Ethiopia. Just a sample...
'In 1911, Italy went to war with the Ottoman Empire and invaded Ottoman Tripolitania. One of the most notorious incidents during this conflict was the October Tripoli massacre, wherein an estimated 4,000 inhabitants of the Mechiya oasis were killed as retribution for the execution and mutilation of Italian captives taken in an ambush at nearby Sciara Sciat. Over the course of three days, Libyan and Turkish men, women, and children were indiscriminately murdered in the streets, in their houses, farms, and gardens. Libyan and Turkish women were also reportedly raped and sexually assaulted by Italian troops, prompting ferocious and violent retaliation against captured Italian troops by Ottoman soldiers.[1] In another incident during the war reported by a British officer serving with the Turkish forces, Italian soldiers burned several hundred civilians in a mosque, wherein women and children had taken refuge. In 1912, 10,000 Turkish and Arab troops were imprisoned in concentration camps in Libya, and all Turkish troops were executed.'
emiliya · 22-25, F
@ChipmunkErnie Fascist war crimes? What?
They were seeking retribution. In 1911, Italy was led by King Victor Emmanuel III and Prime Minister Giovanni Giolitti. A Jew was prime minister for a year before Giolitti came in 1911. Mussolini was still a young man at this point; 28 years old. It was before WWI, and certainly before WWII.
They were seeking retribution. In 1911, Italy was led by King Victor Emmanuel III and Prime Minister Giovanni Giolitti. A Jew was prime minister for a year before Giolitti came in 1911. Mussolini was still a young man at this point; 28 years old. It was before WWI, and certainly before WWII.
Northwest · M
Nobody talks about the fascist regime in Spain and I wonder why?
Not exactly a current affairs thing. Franco has been dead for nearly 50 years and Spain is a socialist country, but you're wondering why no one is talking about the fascist regime in Spain. 🤣🤣🤣
emiliya · 22-25, F
@Northwest 50 years isn't long. My parents had a house in the countryside, where we lived for a year and visited throughout the year the rest of the time. It had an abandoned house nearby. It was like walking into the 1970s.
Our home had been built in the '70s, and was named after the wife of the man who built it.
After we moved to the coast, I found another house that had been abandoned while riding my bike. It had '70s decor and items belonging to that decade.
Our home had been built in the '70s, and was named after the wife of the man who built it.
After we moved to the coast, I found another house that had been abandoned while riding my bike. It had '70s decor and items belonging to that decade.
Northwest · M
@emiliya
My parents had a house as well, but we don't name homes after people. And?
50 years isn't long. My parents had a house in the countryside, where we lived for a year and visited throughout the year the rest of the time. It had an abandoned house nearby. It was like walking into the 1970s.
Our home had been built in the '70s, and was named after the wife of the man who built it.
After we moved to the coast, I found another house that had been abandoned while riding my bike. It had '70s decor and items belonging to that decade.
Our home had been built in the '70s, and was named after the wife of the man who built it.
After we moved to the coast, I found another house that had been abandoned while riding my bike. It had '70s decor and items belonging to that decade.
My parents had a house as well, but we don't name homes after people. And?
SomeMichGuy · M
The Nazis were Fascists. Just a different name, but Adolf learned from Benito.
ChipmunkErnie · 70-79, M
@SomeMichGuy Recvently saw a very interesting video about just what the Nazis were. First thing it did was point out that European and US definitions of Right and Left differ. Anyway, The Nazis had some things in common with the Italian Fascists, but they also had some thing we would consider Socialist -- universal health care for example -- but both systems were totalitarian dictatorships run under a cult of personality, just like Stalin's USSR and Trump';s wannabe USA.
SomeMichGuy · M
@ChipmunkErnie Yes.
emiliya · 22-25, F
There is no need to talk about Spanish fascism in relation to “antisemitism.” What did Spain do? Both Spain and Italy had to be practical in their dealings with Nazi Germany. Fascism was not about racial ideology. It was only after the relationship with Germany that Italy, for practical reasons, introduced the Racial Laws.
Mussolini said: “Race? It is a feeling, not a reality: ninety-five percent, at least, is a feeling. Nothing will ever make me believe that biologically pure races can be shown to exist today.”
Franco did believe that Jews are either Bolshevik communists or greedy capitalists. They are probably the same thing, but with different names. It is not racist to observe the Jewish communist and the Jewish capitalist.
Mussolini said: “Race? It is a feeling, not a reality: ninety-five percent, at least, is a feeling. Nothing will ever make me believe that biologically pure races can be shown to exist today.”
Franco did believe that Jews are either Bolshevik communists or greedy capitalists. They are probably the same thing, but with different names. It is not racist to observe the Jewish communist and the Jewish capitalist.
Deserthiker · 61-69, M
Excellent!!!
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Deserthiker · 61-69, M
@ChipmunkErnie The Nazis were not fascist. They were socialists, nationalists and supremacists. Their economic system was socialism.
Tell me where I did what you said I did.
Tell me where I did what you said I did.
ChipmunkErnie · 70-79, M
@Deserthiker Go argue with Britanica, I give up... "fascism , Philosophy of government that stresses the primacy and glory of the state, unquestioning obedience to its leader, subordination of the individual will to the state’s authority, and harsh suppression of dissent. Martial virtues are celebrated, while liberal and democratic values are disparaged. Fascism arose during the 1920s and ’30s partly out of fear of the rising power of the working classes; it differed from contemporary communism (as practiced under Joseph Stalin) by its protection of business and landowning elites and its preservation of class systems. The leaders of the fascist governments of Italy (1922–43), Germany (1933–45), and Spain (1939–75)—Benito Mussolini, Adolf Hitler, and Francisco Franco—were portrayed to their publics as embodiments of the strength and resolve necessary to rescue their nations from political and economic chaos. Japanese fascists (1936–45) fostered belief in the uniqueness of the Japanese spirit and taught subordination to the state and personal sacrifice."
Deserthiker · 61-69, M
@ChipmunkErnie Hitler was almost there but he was a socialist who wanted to be a fascist. This is why he admired Mussoliniso much.
To make NAZI Germany fascist he would have had to completely take control of the government and all industry. He could not do that. There is no way he was going to nationalize Mercedes Benz, Volkswagen,Merck, Audi, Lufthansa, Hugo Boss, etc……
With slave labor there was way too much money to be made before and during the war. Greed and corruption. He did the next best thing, talked a big talk about the pure race(which oddly included Muslim Palestinians when it’s convenient , you ignore racialism)past glories, the 1000 year reich and everything else to distract and brainwash.
However, his economy was a socialist economy.
I’d say hitler was not a true fascist and had lots of socialist in him.
He sure murdered like a socialist
To make NAZI Germany fascist he would have had to completely take control of the government and all industry. He could not do that. There is no way he was going to nationalize Mercedes Benz, Volkswagen,Merck, Audi, Lufthansa, Hugo Boss, etc……
With slave labor there was way too much money to be made before and during the war. Greed and corruption. He did the next best thing, talked a big talk about the pure race(which oddly included Muslim Palestinians when it’s convenient , you ignore racialism)past glories, the 1000 year reich and everything else to distract and brainwash.
However, his economy was a socialist economy.
I’d say hitler was not a true fascist and had lots of socialist in him.
He sure murdered like a socialist
Deserthiker · 61-69, M
I apologize for hijaking your post. I will stop now. I promise.