it is sad how the women in afghanistan r literally having their freedoms, aspirations and hopes taken away overnight...😢😢😢

@ozgirl512 I don't know anyone that wants to be a kept person. That being said, there are swaths of our population that would be better off if all their decisions were made by someone else.

@ozgirl512 I think what people tend to forget is internal sexism, where women bring their oppression and internalize it to rationalize their abuse.

https://www.womensrepublic.net/internalized-sexism-why-some-women-find-comfort-in-tearing-other-women-down/

This is the reality for women:

[quote][b]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treatment_of_women_by_the_Taliban[/b]
Punishments were often carried out publicly, either as formal spectacles held in sports stadiums or town squares or spontaneous street beatings. Civilians lived in fear of harsh penalties as there was little mercy; women caught breaking decrees were often treated with extreme violence.[11] Examples include:

In October 1996, a woman had the tip of her thumb cut off for wearing nail varnish.[11]
In December 1996, Radio Shari'a announced that 225 Kabul women had been seized and punished for violating the sharia code of dress. The sentence was handed down by a tribunal and the women were lashed on their legs and backs for their misdemeanor.[26]
In May 1997, five female CARE International employees with authorisation from the Ministry of the Interior to conduct research for an emergency feeding programme were forced from their vehicle by members of the religious police. The guards used a public address system to insult and harass the women before striking them with a metal and leather whip over 1.5 meters (almost 5 feet) in length.[1]

Public execution of a woman, known as Zarmeena, by the Taliban at the Ghazi Sports Stadium, Kabul, November 16, 1999. The mother of seven children had been found guilty of killing her husband while he slept, after allegedly being beaten by him.[27][28]
In 1999, a mother of seven children was executed in front of 30,000 spectators in Kabul's Ghazi Sport stadium for murdering her husband (see right). She was imprisoned for three years and extensively tortured prior to the execution, yet she refused to plead her innocence in a bid to protect her daughter (reportedly the actual culprit).[29]
When a Taliban raid discovered a woman running an informal school in her apartment, they beat the children and threw the woman down a flight of stairs (breaking her leg) and then imprisoned her. They threatened to stone her family publicly if she refused to sign a declaration of loyalty to the Taliban and their laws.[15]
An Afghan girl named Bibi Aisha was promised to a new family through a tribal method of solving disputes known as baad. When she fled the violence girls often suffer under baad, her new family found her, and a Taliban commander ordered her to be punished as an example, "lest other girls in the village try to do the same thing".[30] Her ears and nose were cut off and she was left for dead in the mountains, but survived.[30]
Working women are threatened into quitting their jobs. Failure to comply with the Taliban's threats has led to women being shot and killed, as in the case of 22-year-old Hossai in July 2010.[31][32]
In 2013, Indian author Sushmita Banerjee was shot dead by Taliban militants for allegedly defying Taliban dictates. She was married to an Afghan businessman and had recently relocated to Afghanistan. Earlier, she had escaped two instances of execution by Taliban in 1995 and later fled to India. Her book based on her escape from Taliban was also filmed in an Indian movie.[33]
On 12 July 2021, a woman in Faryab Province was beaten to death by Taliban militants and her house was set alight.[34]
In August 2021, Taliban militants killed an Afghan woman in Balkh Province for wearing tight clothing and not being accompanied by a male relative.[35]
In 17 August 2021, Taliban militants killed an Afghan woman in Takhar Province for not wearing a head covering.[36][/quote]

@IronHamster Once again, I imagine the people you know are western people who think the same as you... We Were talking about a different culture and a different religion... If they had the same aspirations as the West the current situation wouldn't be happening

@ozgirl512 It's common for arraigned marriages too though it happens in the states with different Christian groups as well and not just Islam but on a larger scale.

I can't find the particular story but there was a story of a certain river there where children go to drown themselves once they learn they're of age to marry, of age being like 12 years old to a 50 year old man.

[b]https://www.dw.com/en/afghan-women-escape-marriage-through-suicide/a-16750044[/b]

@ozgirl512 [quote]We Were talking about a different culture and a different religion[/quote]

Can we just pretend that child marriage, killing people publicly for being infidels and killing minority Muslim groups have nothing to do with it being a different culture and just refer to it as murderous tyrants instead lol.

@SatanBurger There is some truth to that. But that doesn't follow to other nations needing a white savior colonial empire coming in, bombing the place till the rubble bounces and 20 years of occupation and then telling them how they will save them with their superior enlightened attitudes.

@SatanBurger that works for me... As long as you also throw in the Christians did the same things a few hundred years back ;)

@ozgirl512 Hundreds of years ago? You have Nick Fuentes saying the US fought on the wrong side just a few days ago.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow I didn't say the white savior thing was right, I'm just arguing against the logic that Muslim women somehow want this because it's a "different culture." Unless I bring something up like that, that wasn't near what I was talking about.

And that us rude Westerns don't know anything at all when Muslim women have spoken up about it themselves, I just think the tone is off putting but that's how I read into it, I could be wrong.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow Lol...I was trying to stay away from Gilead, I mean American politics 🤣

@ozgirl512 I don't know why you're so rude when I wasn't and honestly I don't get what you're saying because you sound illogical getting angry at people talking about oppression, particularly when we've heard it from Muslim women themselves. I mean to deny Muslim women's experiences is to deny their reality, all to snub at Westerners. There's a lot of criticism about Westerners in societal attitudes but I don't get your criticism here when there's nothing to criticize except that you're trying to white wash abuse which makes you an enabler.

All to snub Westerners, it's just such a pitiful thing to do.

I could be wrong but seriously I'm confused as to why you're angry and rude about something you shouldn't be, if the abuse isn't happening to you, you should have more empathy for Muslim women and what they go through.

[quote]ozgirl512 · 26-30, F
@CULTure that works for me... As long as you also throw in the Christians did the same things a few hundred years back ;)
[/quote]

Child marriage works for you? Because that's what I was talking about and actually Christian child marriage goes today, if I didn't say that it happened a few hundred years back, don't make up stuff to appear to sound intelligent because it appears you know next to nothing if you didn't honestly know that there was child marriage going on in enclosed communities in the United States.

You're a piece of work for being so dishonest which I didn't take you to be before but I guess true colors shine through eventually so thanks for exposing what you are.

@SatanBurger Just the entire conversation has a very white savior flavor to it and this idea that these people are incapable of changing their country themselves is used to justify these puppet "nation building" projects that were never about improving the lives of the people. It is always about US geopolitical interests.

Just like the assault on Libya which nearly everyone in the west has forgotten about was justified as "protecting the people" and since the NATO fiasco it has been reduced to a collection of warring factions with open slave markets for the first time in centuries. It started out as having the highest standard of living in all of Africa.

If you want to help people you drop food, medicine, build schools. You don't bomb and occupy. And I am sorry to say but history suggests in 3 months this will be like the Kony 2012 thing. Nobody in the west will even remember or care.


As for the different cultures different cultures find different ways to move forward on their own. And sadly if that way doesn't benefit Washington that will almost certainly be undermined.

See the Kurds as an example. They have a saying that their only friends are the mountains because they are at a point that they expect to be thrown under the bus whenever bigger nations have no use for them.

@SatanBurger sorry...is not trying to be rude .... My looking is this... There are very many happy Muslim women who enjoy being who they are.
The Taliban is an extreme form... Hopefully they'll calm down.
Christians in the past have acted in a not dissimilar fashion... Check out his young Catherine of Aragon was when she was promised to Henry

@SatanBurger I will also point out that the US plunged Afghanistan into chaos in the 70s and started all of this mess because they achieved progress in a way that was ideologically offensive to the US. Their nation was literally destroyed "because communism."

@ozgirl512 let’s look at it through the eyes of the entire world over the past 70 years. Before the taliban, Afghan women dressed like western women and worked and went to university. Afghanistan was a fairly modern country. It was only when the taliban took over in the early nineties that they ended all of those rights for women and confined women to their homes, banned television and music, and held public executions. They enforced their strict and perverse interpretation of Sharia law on the country. Now the taliban have full rule over the country yet again and are holding executions as I write this. What part of any of that would a mother want for her child no matter what part of the world she is from?

@Jenny1234 Actually this goes back way farther than the Taliban and the 90s. This all started in the late 70s and 80s when the US basically torpedoed all that "because communism."

@Jenny1234 I'm not condoning the Taliban's version of Islam...

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow I fully agree, I never disagreed in the slightest, I haven't disagreed with anything you wrote thus far. Any country under occupation isn't a good thing. But my problem is when people pretend to speak FOR other me, like I'm NOT my Govt. I can't go and hold them hostage and say "don't do occupation or else" so it's a little unfair to tell people what they don't or do care about specifically because they are only Westerners and little else.

I could see someone saying a rant about Westerners if the person who made the post was actually being ignorant but they're not. They're having empathy for what women go through and what women have said themselves.

You would have a point if anything ignorant was being said for sure but there's no point here, the only point was to literally bash on Westerners on an article talking about female abuse.

Furthermore, you do you realize that when we talk of relevant events and let's say I'm writing something genuine and you start with "you Westerners" you realize you make the ENTIRE conversation about yourself right?

The entire conversation is going to get a bunch of Americans trying to defend themselves while taking away from the actual subject at hand which is abuse by the Taliban against females and people being concerned.

@ozgirl512 Oh okay well sorry for assuming you were being rude, I'll check it out Catherine of Aragon right now.

@PicturesOfABetterTomorrow A lot of lives were destroyed because communism. I know that we supplied money to Islamic groups to fight communists and they ended up killing nuns and priests because of it. When the war stopped, they disbanded into the Taliban so I know that.

@SatanBurger that's ok... It is a hot topic and it will inflame people ...

@SatanBurger I think the bottom line is not everyone wants to live a western life style

@SatanBurger You had me until you said you can't do anything about your government. You may have been taught that but many countries manage it quite well. Women in Poland brought the entire nation to a complete stop to protest anti abortion laws. In France the government knows not to pull anything the public won't like because they can pull off a general strike in very short order.

But in the US and Canada we are taught all you can do is vote once every 4 years.


And when you are talking about a general narrative about a subject you speak in general terms. And no it doesn't make it all about you. If certain people get defensive because they resemble the remark that is on them.

There is a reason why #NotAllx is treated with ridicule.

And frankly Afghans will figure it out on their own regardless of what people in the US on social media have to say about it.

@ozgirl512 I've disagreed with people banning the hijab for an example because I think there's other reasons other than oppression, like religious reasons. I can also guess that not every woman wants to show her face to the world and she may even feel more secure.

Not everyone feels oppressed but the way I see it is that most Muslim countries have some rule in place whether your face can be shown, fully covered, partially covered or face punishment.

The less harsher sentence is a fine. So while not all women feel that way, there's a difference in making religious LAWS rather than just giving people the freedom to dress however they want. It's this distinction in which I define oppression in the first place.

Because the women who are actually punished for wearing the hijab the wrong way which has been a lot, they are at the expense of the ones who don't feel like anything is wrong.

There is such thing as trauma bonding as well.

@SatanBurger all true and you'll find no argument from me on those grounds ... I'll just point out that Christian religion has had some similar customs in the past, just for balance