Pro choice women here, a question

@Notsimilarreally and if a women doesnt want to get pregnant, she should use birth control or make sure guy is using protection or not have sex

@Torsten sure, if she doesn't want to get pregnant she should ensure birth control is being used but to say she should make sure guy is using protection confuses me a little bit. A man's penis and applying a condom is his own responsibility. She shouldn't have to make sure he is protecting himself from a pregnancy he doesn't want lol

@Notsimilarreally so what a women allows in her body is not her responsibility?

@Torsten i dont think you're aware of thr amount of men that refuse to wear a condom, or slip it off part way through, or use emotional blackmail to guilt a woman into letting him not use one .
I know you're gonna say we should be smarter, stronger etc. But when you love someone - these split decisions are hard, and can have you punished later .

I know myself . Even with a long-term partner.
He was willing to let me fall pregnant at a mature age - just coz 'he didnt want to'.

And me refusing , i think was one more nail in the coffin to the death of our relationship.

And in the arguments we had, it was bought up that "i shunned him" - "i was the shrew" .

No....i was smart .
But it took me years to get there🤷

Its an incredibly complex social, economical and emotional issue that is rarely black and white .

@OogieBoogie if a man refuses to put a condom on, women should refuse him sex.
Sorry but to say otherwise sounds like passing all responsibility and blame on men here.

@Torsten oh i totally agree.
But then, ive also been raped - so ...... when it comes to some men - some dont take no for an answer 🤷

Like i said - its a very complex thing.

@OogieBoogie im sorry to hear that but rape is a different and very rare scenario when it comes to abortion. Not even surpassing 1% of abortions done i believe.

Obviously when rape happens, women dont have control of the situation but every other single time women have all the power when it comes to sex and if women refused men sex unless he wore a condom, no man will refuse that

@Torsten im not relating rape to abortion - om relating rape (and conotations of it) to why some women let this happen to them .

Its ....lets say, "safer" for a wife or girlfiend to acquiesce, than to say no.
Men can be very controlling and domineering, if you get my drift . Sometimes its not wise to say no ..... and the woman learns to regret that she tried to .

@OogieBoogie i get that and know you werent but I thought i would point out just how rare rape is when it comes to abortions.

I get there are men like that, that dont like to hear no.
maybe women need to not settle for men like that and find better men who wont ever treat a woman like that cause there is way more men like that, than the men you describe.

I am not trying to discredit what you're saying btw. I know what you're saying is correct but it doesnt have to be that way

@Notsimilarreally idk should a sperm donor be financially liable for their offspring? They are the father.

@OogieBoogie I won't even give any more energy than I did to this argument....totally ridiculous. But you made alot of good points. 🤗

@Notsimilarreally thanks.
It is an incredibly complcated issue, with so many variables, its prolly why its such a mess - no government wants to touch it. Each case is different.

@OogieBoogie tons of variables indeed. Yeah me and the government hahah 😆

@OogieBoogie see, now he's manipulating words and intentions. Why even conversate with that much less debate. 😆

@Torsten Er, hang on a minite.
You expect her to be resposible for herself, her contraception, and the mans responsibility of contraception, and his dick, and the sperm that comes out of it .....wheres the mans responsibility in all this ?

@Notsimilarreally when you put all blame on men and hold women to no accountability, how else am i meant to take it?

@Notsimilarreally dude sounds like Andrew Tate

@SkeetSkeet so desperate for an argument too. 😩

@Notsimilarreally well when you talk about me, I am going to respond. its not my fault you have the worst opinions and have trouble backing it up when someone questions them