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Why does Zelenskyy invoke tragic events?

Since Russia invaded Ukraine in February, Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy has invoked the Holocaust to Israel, the Blitz to the British Parliament, Pearl Harbour to the U.S Congress, and the Berlin Wall to the German Bundestag. The most inappropriate comparison has definitely been the Holocaust, because this was not a war or an attack on a nation for political reasons. Jewish people were systematically targeted by the Nazis and there was absolutely no provocation for it, and nothing they could do about it. As I have said to people in my post about Ukraine, in a war you are presented with choices...you can choose to fight, or you can choose to surrender. If you surrender, the general rule is that your army and your people will no longer be under attack. Even if they have to live under an oppressive government, they are still *not* going to be subjected to mass murder in the way that Jewish people were during the Holocaust.

It seems to me that Zelenskyy will just use whatever tragic event he can with the intention of targeting his specific audience with it. This is obviously because he wants to get something out of them (e.g military equipment, financial aid, etc.) but it's so incredibly disingenuous. I think his thoughts on the Holocaust in particular are testament to how so many former Soviet (yes, I know it doesn't exist now but the mentality still does) Jews still view the Holocaust. I know that many in Ukraine and in other former Soviet States do recognize the horror for what it was...there are some who just don't though. I see Zelenskyy as more of a Ukrainian nationalist than as someone whose great-grandparents perished because they were Jews. His grandfather and other family members were allowed by the Soviets to join the Soviet Army.

In Ukraine, because of a combination of Soviet policies and Ukrainian nationalism, there historically hasn't been that much openness about the Holocaust and how Jewish people were slaughtered en masse simply for being Jews. They were told that all people in Eastern Europe suffered, and that the Nazis killed everyone. They were made to believe, or at least say they believed, that there was nothing unique to Jewish suffering. I think if Zelenskyy had a greater awareness and didn't prioritize nationalism over basic historical realities, he could never have used the Holocaust as a comparison to what is presently happening in Ukraine. It's genuinely beyond comprehension that he did.

Back to the wider point I am making though, it isn't right or fair to go to other nations and bring up unfortunate events they have had in recent history just to get your own way.

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CountScrofula · 41-45, M

He's doing it for exactly the reasons you say. And importantly, it works. It is also pretty damn cynical. He's also not a Ukrainian nationalist lol. What kind of nationalist tries to join the EU.

Emiliomarti · 70-79, M

It is convenient for him now to join the EU..
Also for the rich that he is..

SW-User

@CountScrofula He may not be a nationalist but he's worked suspiciously closely with the Azov battalion (or Azov regiment, now). So, does it really make any difference?

Also, it's the kind of nationalist who wants to feel protected against Russia that wants to join the EU.

LegendofPeza · 61-69, M

@SW-User 'he's worked suspiciously closely with the Azov battalion' - he must be a nazi then huh , just like Putin told us.

SW-User

@SW-User I mean having your country invaded does kind of motivate one to be a nationalist...even if the ones doing the invading are themselves nationalists...

SW-User

@LegendofPeza Is that what I said?

SW-User

@SW-User Yes, I agree? However, he's been working with Azov for at least six years now

LegendofPeza · 61-69, M

@SW-User It's what you intimated.

SW-User

@LegendofPeza No, it was simply a fact.

LegendofPeza · 61-69, M

@SW-User So what is 'suspicious' about it then ?

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SW-User

@LegendofPeza Why work with a group of people who have been accused of being nationalists? That's what is suspicious about it. That even if he is not a nationalist himself, he chose to work with them. Especially since it didn't just happen, it's been going on for years.

Btw, since you all seem to have a tendency to jump to conclusions, I'm not supporting and I would never support Putin. But facts are facts, that's all I'm trying to say.

SW-User

@SW-User I would guess that he chose to work with them because for better or for worse, they are a primary opposition force to the incursion of Russia in eastern Ukraine. I think Zelensky is more globalist than nationalist, but he will back nationalist groups who are fighting the Russians.

And I wouldn't accuse you of supporting Putin. I've been accused of supporting Putin because I said we should not send American troops to Ukraine, something I still stand by.

SW-User

@SW-User Yes and I still agree! But that doesn't mean that my very first statement doesn't still stand. If you work with nationalists then you should expect that you're gonna be accused of being one. That's all.

LegendofPeza · 61-69, M

@SW-User ' Why work with a group of people who have been accused of being nationalists? '

Because after Maidan the Azov regiment was the only competent fighting force capable of fighting the Russian separatists. And if it wasn't for their heroics holding the invaders at bay for as long as they did in Mariupol then the Russian invasion might have easily succeeded.

Your nudge nudge wink wink comments are little more than Russian propaganda. The far right leadership of Azov is a thing of the past. The regiment was subsumed into the Ukranian Army proper a long time ago.

You want to find some real Nazis ? Try the Wagner Group for size.

Burnley123 · 41-45, M

@SW-User Basically the liberals of Kiev have a marriage of convenience with the far right in their country. 'They are arseholes but arseholes who are fighting on our side,' sums up the attitude

Is this a damning criticism or an understandable compromise? I don't know.

The idea that Ukraine is a NAZI regime is Russian propeganda but TBF you haven't said that.

SW-User

@LegendofPeza You can read my other comment or I can just repeat myself. My point is that you cannot work with nationalists and not expect to be accused of being one.

The far right leadership of Azov is a thing of the past. The regiment was subsumed into the Ukranian Army proper a long time ago.

Exactly!! Whether they decided neo-nazism didn't work for them anymore or not, unfortunately, means nothing to many, especially for us in eastern and south- eastern Europe who were familiar with the Azov battalion way before this war. I'm not saying I'm one of them, I never said that. All I've been trying to say is that it's absolutely normal for people to associate Zelenskyj with nationalism!

LegendofPeza · 61-69, M

@SW-User And people who keep repeating that claim are either wittingly or unwittingly doing Putin's work for him. You don't hear so much now about the 'de-nazification' of Ukraine (his original rationale for the invasion) now for a very good reason ....... absolutely no-one was buying it.

SW-User

@LegendofPeza Except Ukraine does have Nazis. As she said, the Azov regiment are entirely comprised of Nazis and they are in the Ukrainian army.

LegendofPeza · 61-69, M

@SW-User ' Except Ukraine does have Nazis. ' - So does Russia.

' the Azov regiment are entirely comprised of Nazis ' - After reading what I wrote earlier you still come out with a stupid , ignorant and wrong comment like that ?

There's no hope.

SW-User

@LegendofPeza lol it's a fact that the Azov regiment are Nazis. Why are you refusing to recognize the significance of that?

And, I'm talking about Zelenskyy and Ukraine...not Russia. You are intentionally trying to deflect from what I have said and I am not going to further indulge it. So, to go back to what I originally said, is it right for Zelenskyy to compare the war in Ukraine to the Holocaust and to use tragic and unfortunate events from other countries to further his agenda? What do you think the moral implications are to that, especially with regard to his Holocaust comparison?

Emiliomarti · 70-79, M

@LegendofPeza
It is true- Regiment Azov was made up of convinced nazis..fully recognized by the Ukranian Army.
I said 'was' ..cause once again, after Stalingrad, Azov nazis surrendered even without fighting by the Red (Russian) Army. Must be a destiny. They were good only in making tattoes on their bodies. They deserve a new Nurberg process for all the crimes that they did