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You can’t tell me that the whole anti Israel thing has nothing to do with antisemitism when

When they’re literally spewing “FREE PALESTINE!!1!” and calling me a kike in the same breath.

Yes, I’ve literally been called a kike for not hating Israel.

And don’t you just love it when you literally give an example of people saying and doing bigoted things towards you and someone has to roll their eyes and pipe in about how your people have a “victim mentality,” because acknowledging that someone called you a slur is so totally whiny and not valid evidence that they hate you because of bigotry.

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CountScrofula · 41-45, M

Right now there is an incredible amount of antisemitism. Every Jewish person I know is scared right now and a lot of historical traumas are being unearthed. Jewish businesses were being burned in Canada. That's real and those of us who want a free Palestine need to reckon with who they're letting under the big umbrella and what these people are doing. This is also a movement that has a LOT of Jewish people involved.

There is still an ongoing ethnic cleansing with the only imaginable outcome being the complete depopulation of an area for settlement. The erasure of this homeland for the Palestinians has been a longstanding, publicly stated goal by a large number of extremists in politics in Israel. Bibi is not just a war criminal, he's a criminal under Israeli law, and piling up the bodies of children to evade the consequences for his amorality and corruption.

Motzu

The Left has been anti-semetic since before WW2. At no time within the last few hundred years, since their ancestors came here from Europe, have their ancestors NOT been Anti-Semetic, and it comes as second nature to them. They never had to question themselves, and keep themselves culturally insulated.

Catholic, but back in basic training I often went to the Jewish services after I broke my ribs and was stuck on a starvation diet in basic training until I healed. They had a buffet after every service and a large jewish library rich in medieval jewish philosophy texts. I've always felt close to them, but not enough to cut my foreskin. They generally are nice people.

Just at the same time I differentiate between war crimes (Israel cutting off water access in the first days of the war) from Judism. I watched every video I coukd find of the Hamas attrocities and know they need eradicated, but at the same time maximum effort needs to be made to preserve palestinian lives. Israeli command at times seemed confused and perplexed at the basics of western just war theory even though the Ashkenazi Jews grew up in that tradition as much as anyone in the west. Heck, Onasander (the roman writer) was even copied to a extent in the Dead Sea Scrolls. It isn't a theory alien that's trefah to Judiasm.

But both Israel and the Jews broke Just War Theory. Hamas did worst, and Hamas had no redeeming qualities. I follow the news closely on OSINT channels, no point for someone butting in to stump me on some event, I already know, and Hamas is far worst. The world can't live with a Hamas state, but it can live with a Israeli state, it does contribute to the larger world culture and does take care of it's people, including Muslims. Just Hamas is rotten and evil to jt's core. It had no future except the furtherance of genocide and hatred. That's all it is, and so I have no sympathy for it. It's a true evil and blight on the heart of global humanity.

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basilfawlty89 · 31-35, M

@Motzu um...once again, wading throigh your waffle shows you know nothing of the left. The Old Left didn't like the idea of a Nietzschean elite. The Old Left was influenced by Hegel and Feuerstein, not Nietzsche.

The modern left is influenced by Kropotkin, Sankara, Popper and Chomsky. Not to mention Bookchin.

The latter two are ethnic Jewish people.

Elessar · 26-30, M

@Motzu You're under the impression that "unconventional" love defines left vs right, in reality you'll find as many queer, homosexuals and bisexuals among rigtwingers than you'll find among left-winger. The only difference is that the former stay in the closet and want it to be an elitist thing whereas the latter want to remove the taboo associated to it after two millennia of monotheistic societal regression.

What defines left/right is the economy, or if you want the progressive (left) / conservative (center) /regressive (right) axis, and fascisti in the past just like fascists in the modern era very much aligns at (far) right using all the aforementioned criteria.

Also 100% of the historians classify fascism and Nazism (and consequently, neofascism and neonazism) as far-right movements. Indeed, if you leaned left during the 1930-1940s you would've been sent to a death camp.

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Ozymandiaz

The antisemitism thing is in there for sure. It is not acceptable even if Israel is committing genocide.

BohemianBabe · M

If that actually happened, then yes, that was racist. But that doesn't mean it's ok for Israel to commit genocide, and it doesn't mean everyone who opposes Israel's government is racist against Jews. Just like it's not racism against Russians to oppose Russia's invasion of Ukraine.

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BohemianBabe · M

@Zeuro That's like saying the Holocaust wasn't a genocide because a few Jews robbed a German store once.

GeistInTheMachine · 31-35, M

@BohemianBabe And the funny thing is that the Nazis used excuses like that to glass Jewish stores and run them out of their homes. It's so ugly to see it again and some of the decendants of the victims are excusing it!

Never Again means Never Again!

BohemianBabe · M

@GeistInTheMachine Yeah, the perpetrators of war crimes always pretend they're on the defensive. When the Nazis invaded Poland and destroyed Warsaw, they claimed it was because Poland was mistreating their German minority. Maybe that was true, but that doesn't justify murdering Polish civilians.
Now Israel is doing the same thing by committing war crimes, then playing the victim, pretending they have no choice because of Hamas.

BlueVeins · 22-25

Really just depends on the person. I'm sorry that happened to you. <3

Roundandroundwego · 61-69

It's not anti semitic to object to the removal of Palestine. V

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Roundandroundwego · 61-69

@LeopoldBloom not at all. Israel itself was Europe's own antisemitic and nationalist project for Jews. It's the final solution and it's not right.

LeopoldBloom · M

@Roundandroundwego Post again when you sober up. "Europe" didn't have a "project" to settle Jews in that area. There has always been a Jewish community in what is now Israel, in an unbroken line since antiquity. In the late 1800s, the Zionist movement began and European Jews began emigrating there, purchasing land from the Ottomans or Arab landlords. After World War One, the British Mandate replaced the Ottomans and Jewish emigration increased, along with Arab violence. The British limited Jewish immigration during World War Two when it could have saved lives, because they didn't want to upset the Arabs who were aligned with Hitler. So hardly a "European colonial project." The only antisemitism was from the Arabs and the Europeans who limited immigration.

The 1947 partition was rejected by the Arabs, as they couldn't stand the idea of Jews not being dhimmis as they were elsewhere in MENA.

Calling Israel the "final solution" is disgusting. Let me guess, your "solution" to the Israel-Palestine issue is a judenrein Middle East.

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ffony · M

@Zeuro: Sounds as if no one could tell you anything.

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LeopoldBloom · M

These are people who claim to not hate Jews, while supporting the destruction of the only state where Jews have self-determination and have had it for 76 years.

Imagine if someone said "I don't hate Mexicans, but the country of Mexico is oppressive and should not exist."

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GeistInTheMachine · 31-35, M

I am sorry for the blowback you are experiencing. However the Palestinians are suffering through far worse and I feel it is important to keep that into perspective that if maybe the country that claimsto represent you is creating antisemitic sentiments in some people, perhaps you shouldtake a better look at that country. God Bless you, always.

Zeuro · 26-30, F

@GeistInTheMachine ah there it is, blaming Israel for other people’s bigotry against Jews.

GeistInTheMachine · 31-35, M

@Zeuro Oh, get over yourself.

[media=https://youtu.be/_mwcFEpAYkU]

That's the country you're defending.

Yeah, that's going to cause blowback, sadly.

Cry about it or stand up for what is right or sit down and complain about people being mean to you online.

Grow up.

If you can't understand this from any other perspective then yes, people are going to hate you for it.

It's a simple calculation. Genocide is genocide. Never Again applies to us all.

emiliya · 22-25, F

literally, literally, literally?!

What is valid evidence?

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Zeuro · 26-30, F

@emiliya ??

emiliya · 22-25, F

@Zeuro qué?

Zeuro · 26-30, F

@emiliya I have no idea what your original comment was supposed to mean

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Old51 · 70-79, M

Can we discuss our view in DM

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LeopoldBloom · M

@Jimbo1 The OP is Jewish, but even if she wasn't, why would that matter? Am I not allowed to support Ukraine because I'm not Ukrainian? The anti-Israel contingent is always trotting out Finkelstein, Peleg, and Sand as if their opinions are valid because they're Jewish.

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