Women To Remain Silent?

@LadyGrace Many churches still prefer the woman to be submissive.

@LadyGrace well said Grace.😔

@JSul3 No, most don't, and if they do, they're cults.

@LadyGrace Southern Baptists tossed a church because the pastor was a woman.

@LadyGrace Suggest you read:
Southern Baptists say no to women pastors, uphold expulsion of Saddleback megachurch
Updated June 14, 2023 4:16 PM ET/NPR

The Southern Baptist Convention voted overwhelmingly Wednesday to uphold earlier decisions to expel two churches because they have women pastors.

The decision came during the group's annual meeting in New Orleans. The SBC heard appeals by California megachurch Saddleback and a smaller church, Fern Creek Baptist in Louisville, Ky.

Saddleback Church ordained a woman as a campus pastor, and the Kentucky congregation has had a woman pastor, Rev. Linda Popham, for more than three decades.

The SBC's 2000 statement of faith, called Baptist Faith and Message, asserts that only qualified men can serve as pastors, and the nearly 13,000 voters, who are called "messengers," voted to uphold the churches' removals.

@JSul3 Uh, yeh! I already addressed that. Read my answer.

@JSul3 You said women are subservient and second class. That's where I said you're wrong. Not pertaing to women in the pulpit. I already told you that women are not to be in the pulpit. The Bible makes that clear.

@LadyGrace "You said women are subservient and second class."

I never said that.
I said that many churches prefer that women be subservient.

I DO NOT AGREE! I despise religions because THEY DO NOT SEE WOMEN AS EQUALS! Women deserve to have the same rights as men.

It was fools like Phyllis Schlafly who sabotaged the passing of the Equal Rights Amendment.

@LadyGrace Women deserve to be in the pulpit as much as any man.
BS scripture....written by men.

@JSul3 [quote]Women deserve to be in the pulpit as much as any man.
BS scripture....written by men.[/quote]

You better tell that to the Lord then and tell him what he wrote was BS because he's the one that said women are not to preach from the pulpit. They have other areas in which they can serve the Lord and minister within the church. Whether you believe it or not. 1 Corinthians 11:3-12, 14:34-35, 1 Timothy 2:11-15 and Titus 1, 2. These passages are the foundation for the conclusion that women cannot lead as pastors in churches. Has nothing to do with whether or not they are capable. I'm sure they are, but the Lord said no they are not to preach from the pulpit. Paul's command in 1st Timothy 2:12 is not based on cultural circumstances whatsoever. His command that women cannot teach or take authority over men is rooted in the created order and fall of man, and thus binding on all churches for all ages. When it comes to teaching from the pulpit [b]alone[/b], a woman is not to exercise authority over a man. The Apostle affirms the right of women to be present in the worship of the church and to learn, alongside the men, the Word of God as it is read and proclaimed. In this respect, female disciples of Jesus are in every way the equal of male disciples of Jesus.

The context is important here. Paul does not forbid women from any and all teaching activities, even within the church. Rather, Paul forbids women from the public preaching and teaching of the Word of God from the pulpit, when the church is assembled in public worship. This work belongs to the elders of the church and not exercise authority over the men in the church. In the following chapter, Paul will entrust spiritual authority to the church’s elders, qualified men who have demonstrated themselves to be competent managers of their own families. Women are not permitted to hold the office of pastor or to exercise the functions of an elder in the church. This prohibition reflects the order God established in creation for men and women.

@LadyGrace Since you seem to have a direct line, ask:
Why did you murder a woman and turn her into a pillar of salt? Why did you flood the world, killing all innocents, except for Noah and family, and several animals, who were in an ark? Why did you sit back and watch as innocent people...men, women, and children were murdered and raped, throughout history....even today? Why did you sit back and watch the Holocaust, and do nothing to stop it? Are you antisemitic and rooting for Hitler? Why do you allow priests to sexually assault children?

Now, Lady Grace, I don't expect you to be able to answer or get answers from your lord or anybody else, to these and the many other questions I have. Please refrain from quoting more bible verses.

If I am able to one day stand before god or whoever, I will pose these questions myself.

@JSul3 Boy, you really go off the deep end, don't you....now you're into all these other areas, which by the way, the Bible does answer. You should know that [i]every[/i] believer has a direct line to God, through prayer and His Word. Those questions are not hard, God answers them in His Word, where I get all my answers, and He expects us to, through careful Bible study. And that's not being arrogant, because [b]anyone[/b] can have that and does, who wants Christ in their heart and lives.

@LadyGrace Yes...God's answer to those Jews being tortured and killed by the Nazi's, praying and begging was: "NO!"

Guess he is ignoring those in HI too.

@JSul3 Hitler won't go unpunished, but don't blame God for evil men's ways.

@LadyGrace Suggest you read what few Holocaust survivors alive today have to say about how they feel god abandoned them.
They have a reason to feel that way.

@JSul3 I didn't say they didn't, but can you imagine if God fixed every problem or tragedy we ever had? Don't even hint that God doesn't care. He showed He does and proved that on the cross. He came to save souls from hell, not interfere with man's free will. We reap what we sow and sometimes, you know, people don't call on God, unless they want something from him, and trample him under foot, so there's selfishness that comes into play there, too, don't forget. Was it fair that Jesus was hung on a cross for sins he didn't even commit, because of our sins? No person on this Earth has suffered more than Jesus. Some want nothing to do with him, until a tragedy strikes and some have never believed and don't want to believe and curse him....nor have anything to do with him. God's mission was to save souls, not fix every problem. If He did that, we would never have any problems and we would never learn and grow in Christ or faith, nor learn from history. You sound more like a nonbeliever. Always blaming God for man's sins. God did save some in the Old Testament, but it seems that no matter what God does or does not do, some will always find fault with him.

@LadyGrace I have many unanswered questions. You can't answer them. Nobody can answer them.

You cant have a 'vengeful god' and a 'loving god'....it is either 1 or the other.

Let us agree to disagree.

@JSul3 You assume I can't answer them. Some I can, and some I can't, but I do know that God is just and incapable of error. And for some, no matter what God does or does not do, some will always find fault with him. He tells us what we need to know and the rest we'll find out when we cross over. But the most important thing to know is how to get to heaven. God's Plan of Salvation takes care of that because he didn't leave us to guess on that. Yet still, man even tries to change that.

@LadyGrace So do me a favor and return to my earlier post, and answer my questions. I am open to hearing your answers.
Having said that, if you believe that god does not make mistakes, then we are to accept that every child born with a birth defect, cancer, or cystic fibrosis, or born as gay or trans, was exactly as god intended?

@JSul3 Well, He certainly is not a hateful God. The Bible says there's no evil in him, and He didn't come to condemn the world, but to save it.

@LadyGrace So why did he turn a woman into a pillar of salt? Why did he wipe out mankind in a flood except for his 'select few?'

@JSul3 I can do that.

[quote]if you believe that god does not make mistakes, then we are to accept that every child born with a birth defect, or born as gay or trans, was exactly as god intended?[/quote]

In the beginning there was no such thing as those. Those came about as sin was introduced to the world. Then we experienced imperfections. Sin always brings death and destruction + seperation from God until we repent and ask forgiveness.

@JSul3 God didn't make a sudden decision to do that. He had asked this evil generation to repent of their sins for over 500 years, but they wouldn't listen and they continued to get more evil. Had God allowed them to live, things would have been much worse. They would have carried over their sins to the next generation, whose hearts would have been hardened even more against God, and they would not have repented and therefore would have contaminated so many others with their unrepenting, hardened hearts and sins. Many more would have ended up in hell.

@JSul3 I’ve lost the plot. I thought this thread was about the position of women in the early church. I had hoped that the comments I made on 15 August clarified this.

How does this lead on to a discussion of children with birth defects?