How man can prove God exists.

I am a theist but I like to discuss with atheists how and why they became atheists, and I welcome atheists to discuss with me how and why I am a theist - all like as we are friends.

Why do I come to an atheists' forum, because sooner than later I always get banned in theists' forums.

So, perhaps I will stay indefinitely in your forum - and I like that very much!

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yrger · 80-89, M

Hi all atheists.

I am Yrger, and I am addressing this post to all atheists:

"There are three ways man comes to know the existence of god:

1. By man's intelligence and his rational faculty and his reasoning process.
2. By reading the Bible for Christians and Orthodox Jews, and the Koran for Muslims.
3. By meditation.

I know god exists by the No. 1 way.

Very briefly:
a. Man is a transient entity i.e. he is here today and then after some years of life like as much as 90 years plus, he dies.
b. The transient existence of man inevitably implicates the existence of god as the permanent self-existent creator and operator of man and the universe and everything transient.
c. So, we are the evidence for the existence of god.
d. Therefore god exists.

You atheists are denying the existence of the biblical god.

Here is my definition of god grounded on man's intelligence and his rational faculty and his reasoning process:
[i]God is the permanent self-existent container of all things, and the creator and operator of man and the universe and everything that is not god Himself.[/i]

I didn't come to that definition of god by searching the bible.

Suppose you employ your intelligence and rational faculty and reasoning process: to deny that god as defined above, did not put you into existence, but something else, like what?"

Entwistle · 56-60, M

@yrger There is nothing permanent or self existent. Nothing exists unchanging for even a moment. All things that have a beginning have an ending. All things are merely labelled by the mind. They have no independent existence. E.g a cake cannot exist independent of its ingredients.

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BlueVeins · 22-25

@yrger [quote]a. Man is a transient entity i.e. he is here today and then after some years of life like as much as 90 years plus, he dies.
b. The transient existence of man inevitably implicates the existence of god as the permanent self-existent creator and operator of man and the universe and everything transient.[/quote]

uhhhhhhhh

DIABLISS

@yrger believing there is a god running things is not intellectual or intelligent...it is irrational and childish

DIABLISS

@yrger If you see a god or gods when meditating ...you are doing it wrong!

DocSavage · M

@yrger
Have you considered things from god’s point of view ? As I said before , too much is impractical for a conscience, intelligent creator.
Look at some of the characteristics usually attributed to god.
God is a spiritual being. He is eternal. He created the universe, and us. We were made in his image. He is the source of good and morality. He is love, and he will judge us for our sins after death. Etc
1) if god was , before creation, the only living being in existence. The only sensation he could possibly have would have to be self awareness. He would have no one and nothing else to respond to. The concept of love, and morality would be unknowable .
If god some how discovered he had the ability to create something outside his own ego. He would need a working model to base it on. Why create a material universe completely alien ? Why not stick with what you do know and make a spiritual universe ? This also brings up the question, why would god have human features ? What use are eyes, ears, mouth, hands , legs , feet ? To god. There’s nothing to see, hear, taste, say, hold , or walk to. He hasn’t created anything yet. If he kept everything on the spiritual side. There would be no need for these features either. We would not need air, light, water, heat. And we wouldn’t need to kill other creatures to stay alive ourselves.
All this is just some of the problems to address before starting creation. Assuming god has some plan in mind , once it happens.
Once he got things going, you have to wonder why , he took so much time getting things going. It took a Hell of a lot of time for stars and planets to form. If god can create thorough sheer will power, than the process should have been immediate. He has no reason to wait, even if time has no meaning for him. The Devil is in the details. Anyway, once he’s got the living quarters established. The next project would be life. He starts at the molecular level. And let’s evolution do the work for him . Again, why wait ?
If god is in control, it wouldn’t have to be so complicated. An intelligent god, could have just set up everything the way he wanted, right at the onset. Obviously all of god’s human interest and qualities were manufactured by humans, and not the other way around. Reality is simply too unrealistic for a loving gong to have made it.

DIABLISS

@DocSavage I think about this alot and it is funny how you even brought up points that i haven't considered. thank you. i wish i didn't waste so much time on this nonsense as a child. i was the only nice person i ever met in Cincinnati. everyone else i met there was insane...on so many levels. But they all claimed to be very Religious...