I Had Or Have To Wear A School Uniform

@retiredschoolteacher Only if the parents are affluent enough to afford the overpriced uniform. Not every family can afford to splash you c.£500 per child to make use of what's supposed to be a free service.

Suppose the other state provided services like the libraries and health service jumped on the bandwagon and required potential users to buy expensive uniform from them to use the "free" service.

@suzie1960 Uniform used have no need to be expensive to be decent

@retiredschoolteacher Schools charge supplier a considerable amount of money, several thousand pounds, to be the "official supplier" of the school uniform. Parents are required to purchase the uniform from the "official supplier", who more than recoups the bribe paid to the school by inflating prices. A pack of 5 T-Shirts can be bought in the supermarket for £10 - similar shirts, but poorer quality, can easily cost £10 each from the "official supplier". It's all a massive rip-off.

Should people be required to wear an expensive uniform to use the local library or health centre too? If not, why should schools be any different?

@dorothyanne We didn't have regulation underwear but we tended to wear something substantial for what little protection from the slipper they gave.

@Sharon We had one teacher " the old witch" she would sometimes pull your knickers uo high, so you got it bare, but you were still wearing knickers.. once told her she was wrong and thaen back chatted her

@dorothyanne In the gym we sometimes had to take our knickers down to be slippered.

I agree. It got very political. Communist the state bears the cost against Capitalist we work hard and pay. The reality is between the two. But competition between Asda and Tesco keeps the price low. Most schools stick to what kids can buy. Like all the skirts are black, grey or navy. a school that wants green or burgundy skirts can expect their parents to have difficulty. It's checks and balances. @Oldmanjimbo

@Oldmanjimbo @Blodyn I suggest you look at ther uniform requirements of a dozen or so random English schools (the situation might be different in Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland). I expect you'll find the majority of them require at least some of the uniform be bought from the school shop or the school's "official supplier". Why would suppliers pay schools several thousand pounds to be the "official supplier" if that didn't give them any advantage over their competitors?


@Oldmanjimbo I don't know how long you've been retired but things have changed a lot. Schools are big business now with "Chief Executive Officers". Their primary function is making money and providing a means for petty dictators to satisfy their cravings by strutting around their little empires. Educating the masses is a thing of the past.

@jackcros As you say, "many years ago". Things have changed dramatically since then with children being excludes for the most stupid and petty reasons. Peele Community College in Long Sutton even excluded students for incorrect uniform even though it had been bought from the school's "official suppliers". No doubt some people will say the parents were in the wrong and making a fuss over nothing. If it's "nothing", why was the school being so inflexible? (That establishment does have a pretty poor reputation locally.)

http://www.spaldingtoday.co.uk/news/education/long-sutton-s-peele-community-college-is-embroiled-in-a-fresh-row-over-uniforms-1-7566800

@Sharon That's very true. My only observation is don't put Dianne Abbott in charge of pricing anything up!! 🤣🤣🤣

@MickB72 A mate said it cost him about £300 to equip his son for primary school. Almost everything had to be bought from the school's appointed supplier. He reckons it will cost at least twice that amount when his son starts secondary school. What happened to the idea of free education?

That's the sort of figure I've heard for primary schools' uniforms. £600 for secondary school doesn't surprise me. The schools have latched on to a very productive cash-cow and they're milking it all they can. The only way this will stop is for schools to be banned from imposing uniforms or, at the very least, being banned from appointing "official suppliers". Alternatively, if they really believe thay can't do their jobs unless their students are wearing a uniform, let them pay for it out of school funds. The cost could be covered by reducing the teachers' salaries to reflect their level of (in)competence.

@Sharon One issue is, is school uniform a good thing, in principle? I think it is, on balance, but there are good arguments on the other side, quite apart from the economic and social arguments you have advanced.

If the answer to the first question is yes, a second issue is how uniforms are to be paid for. A similar issue arises with other costs associated with education, such as sports equipment or musical instruments. I respect your opinion on that issue, though I hope you won't mind my saying that it is perhaps a little idealistic.

@MartinII I disagree with the view that school uniform is a good thing. Other European countries, without school uniforms, have far better educational standards. There, teachers concentrate on education rather than, as one comentator put it, worrying about what colour socks a student is wearing.

Why do you think my opinion on free education is idealistic? What about a free health service or a free fire and rescue service?

@Sharon Well, where do you stop? The state pays for basic teaching, uniform if there is one, meals - fair enough. But should it pay for a good cricket bat or violin for a budding cricketer or musician? All I'm saying is that it's a fine principle which can't necessarily be implemented in practice in all circumstances. And of course there's the perennial question, should things be free for everyone or only those who can't afford them.

Another analogy. I'm over 65, live in London and therefore get free public transport. Looked at in isolation, given that I'm pretty wealthy, that's absurd. But looked at in the round, there are good arguments for giving the benefit to everyone rather than means-testing.

@GirlSerendipity I think it's primarily a British thing, just like the business suit that we forced on the world. It's all to do with exercising control over the peasants.

Yes. And having this number on the sleeve, students felt reticent to misbehave out of school as long as they wore the uniform. The uniform was a good method to make a student responsable of his/her duties and and behaviour at least on the way to and from the school. An indecent behaviour could be easily reported to school.

Having a number makes me feel rather uneasy. It almost sounds like a prison uniform

Maybe, but as long as all students had it, we did not feel like in a prison, but only were obliged to have a good conduct

@MrsKatherineArch I agree entirely.

@Lynda70 I disagree strongly. It is not about enforcing petty rules for the sake of it. It is about creating a calm, disciplined environment in which children are able to learn and achieve their full potential

@Oldmanjimbo The point is, it doesn't work. It's bullying by the teachers and just causes resentment. While teachers are doing that, they're not doing the job they're paid to do. Meanwhile, in other European countries, teachers are busy getting on with the job of educating. They're obviously far more competent than UK teachers because they can achieve far better results, both academically and socially, despite their students not wearing uniforms.

All the evidence shows that school uniforms and petty rules are counter-productive.

@Lynda70 If teachers think they can only do their job if their students are all dressed the same, they're clearly incompetent. They should all be booted out to make room for people who are able to teach. That way, we can start catching up with the rest of Europe.

@NortiusMaximus Actually, there has been some recent improvement in English educational standards, I believe, which has coincided with a greater emphasis on classroom disciplne, including uniforms. Of course, there are lots of other explanations, and there's a long way to go.

@MartinII I think it is just co-incidence. The rest of Europe is well ahead of us with far higher educational and behavioural standards. Is that in spite of or because they don't waste resources enforcing school uniforms and other petty rules? We have long way to go to catch up so we should take note of what those schools are doing and learn from them.