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What Does Freedom Of Religion Mean To You?

What it means to me is that we are free to worship God any way as we please as long as we do not stray from the Truth. Christianity is not a religion made by man regardless of what some may think. Our 'religion,' if you will, is acceptable to God.

27 Pure and undefiled religion before God and the Father is this: to visit orphans and widows in their trouble, and to keep oneself unspotted from the world. James 1:27

34 A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another; as I have loved you, that you also love one another. 35 By this all will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another.” John 13:34-35

23 For I received from the Lord that which I also delivered to you: that the Lord Jesus on the same night in which He was betrayed took bread; 24 and when He had given thanks, He broke it and said, [d]“Take, eat; this is My body which is [e]broken for you; do this in remembrance of Me.” 25 In the same manner He also took the cup after supper, saying, “This cup is the new covenant in My blood. This do, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of Me.” 1 Corinthians 11:23-25

Jesus answered and said to them, “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He sent.” John 6:29

16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.
John 3:16

10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. 11 None of them shall teach his neighbor, and none his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them. 12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins ]and their lawless deeds I will remember no more.” Hebrews 8:10-12

37 Jesus said to him, “‘You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.’ 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.” Matthew 22:37-39

Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God.” John 3:3

This is what Christianity is all about, a close relationship with God and with one another. It is not a stiff-necked religion as some would think it is. There are those stiff-necked religious people who call themselves Christians but their hearts are far from Him. Then there is us who True Believers in Christ whose hearts are after God's own heart. God has established this covenant with us before the foundations of the earth. This is what freedom of religion means to me.

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LeopoldBloom · M

So you think freedom of religion means people should only be allowed to worship in the way you agree with. That's not how it works. The Constitution says "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof." This means people are legally free to follow [i]any[/i] religion.

If people like you were in charge, I have no doubt that you would violently suppress all religion other than your own, and would force everyone to worship your way at gunpoint.

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GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote]So you think freedom of religion means people should only be allowed to worship in the way you agree with.[/quote]

No, to worship God in deed and in Truth without interference of man.

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 So you support religious freedom for all religions, including non-Christian ones, and also allowing people to not worship at all if they don't want to? Because you said people are free to worship however they like as long as it doesn't depart from the "Truth," which I assume means your religion. Once you place limits on religious freedom, it's not free. It's like when Ford said you could have a car in any color you wanted, as long as it was black.

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote]So you support religious freedom for all religions, including non-Christian ones, [/quote]

Not all religions worship God in deed and in Truth save one. John 14:6 Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 So what? Freedom of religion applies to all religions, not just the ones you happen to approve of.

So basically, you're saying that people are free to worship as they choose, as long as they worship exactly the way you do.

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote]So what? Freedom of religion applies to all religions, not just the ones you happen to approve of.[/quote]

It's not me that they have to get approval from.

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 Correct, because you're not in charge. Freedom of religion is granted by the government. Nobody cares what you think, they only care if the government will permit them to worship as they choose without interference.

If you were in charge, would you allow that freedom? Or would you enforce your religion at gunpoint?

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote]Correct, because you're not in charge.[/quote]

You're right but I do know the One who is in charge, which is my Father in heaven, and it's His approval that counts.

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 That's nice, but not everyone agrees with you.

So if you were in charge, would you enforce your religion at gunpoint? Because that's what God would want.

JollyRoger · 70-79, M

@GodSpeed63 I have to disagree with you and support what @LeopoldBloom said: Freedom of religion is not just the 'Truth' as you understand it. The real Truth comes from releasing yourself from cultural boundaries and examining what is 'good' all around you, including the 'good' in other people, despite what 'Religion' they profess to follow. Therefore, Islam, despite what you think it is has its good points that are 'Truths'.... I think you are a bit too indoctrinated in the politics of 'anti-Islam' to understand that Muslim people are good people and that they do value us as 'good' too; I will put a caveat on what I've just written though: as Islamic people are fear-bound by their religious doctrine and are NOT able to release themselves from their cultural boundaries. Much of Christianity suffers the same affliction - and I do encourage you to look at your Christian beliefs in this light.

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom @JollyRoger [quote]That's nice, but not everyone agrees with you.[/quote]

Whether they agree with me or not is not the issue. What is the issue is whether they agree with My Father in heaven or not. He wants us to worship Him in deed and in Truth. Is that so hard to understand?

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 It's clear that you think your way is the only way.

If your God wants everyone to worship him, why doesn't he reveal himself to everyone the way you think he's revealed himself to you?

JollyRoger · 70-79, M

@GodSpeed63 No, that's a truth! It's just the interpretation of 'how' we should worship him as you are trying to dictate. @LeopoldBloom: There's no need for Godspeed's God (same as mine, I think), to descend and talk directly to me = I feel God all around me. He's in the air I breathe, His blessing is in the food I eat, He's given me friends, he's given me a wife and children: How? By giving me my life! I owe it to Him to do good - that is His will unto me.... BUT: He doesn't mean for me to criticize you for how you try to please Him.

LeopoldBloom · M

@JollyRoger It's great if you feel God's presence, but I don't, so it's unreasonable to tell me that I must believe in him anyway based only on yours or godspeed's say-so. Maybe I need more direct proof than you do. So if God wants me to believe in him, why is he hiding himself? Surely as an omniscient being, he knows what proof I would need, and as an omnipotent one, he's capable of providing that proof. So what's he waiting for?

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@JollyRoger @LeopoldBloom [quote]No, that's a truth! It's just the interpretation of 'how' we should worship him as you are trying to dictate.[/quote]

I don't dictate anything, just sharing what God has already shared in one of His books of His Word.

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 I'm very glad you don't dictate anything, and I will resist any attempt to break down the wall of separation between church and state. You should feel the same way, as I'm sure while you'd welcome a government based on your particular religion, you wouldn't want to live under one controlled by a different religion. So a secular government benefits you just as much as it benefits me.

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote]I'm very glad you don't dictate anything, and I will resist any attempt to break down the wall of separation between church and state.[/quote]

Do you know what the phrase means?

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 Yes. The First Amendment includes the Establishment Clause, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion." This means there can be no official state religion. It also includes the Free Exercise Clause, "or prohibiting the free exercise thereof." This means the government cannot restrict the private practice of religion. Taken together, they constitute a wall of separation between church and state. The government can neither promote nor restrict any religion.

This doesn't mean the government can't promote religion in general; for example, religious organizations are exempt from paying taxes, but this applies to all religions equally. Also, legislators and other officials will inevitably be influenced by their religious beliefs if they have any, but they can't cite them overtly in support of policies.

specman · 51-55, M

@LeopoldBloom what qualifications does something have to have to be a religion? Should it have a doctrine?

LeopoldBloom · M

@specman It's based on IRS definitions. These include:

a distinct legal existence and religious history
a recognized creed and form of worship
established places of worship
a regular congregation and regular religious services
an organization of ordained clergy

https://www.legalzoom.com/articles/what-constitutes-a-church-under-federal-laws

specman · 51-55, M

@LeopoldBloom you don’t need proof! I was just asking.

LeopoldBloom · M

@specman OK, I just thought you wanted a complete answer. Having a doctrine would be a requirement, but the other ones are also important. This is why the Church of Scientology is a tax-exempt religion, but the Church of the Sub-Genius or the Pastafarians aren't. The article mentions a youth church that didn't have "established places of worship," but since they met regularly to hold services in different locations, they were given a pass on that requirement. But I don't see how you could call something a "religion" if it has no doctrine.

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote] Taken together, they constitute a wall of separation between church and state. [/quote]

Where in the Constitution is the phrase, separate church and state?

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 There is no specific phrase. I just described the interpretation of separation of church and state. It doesn't say church and state should be combined, either.

Where in the Constitution does it say the US should have a national religion or that religions other than Christianity should be suppressed? The words "Christianity," "Jesus," and "Bible" appear nowhere in the Constitution.

GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M

@LeopoldBloom [quote] I just described the interpretation of separation of church and state. It doesn't say church and state should be combined, either.[/quote]

Like it or not, this country was founded on the Gospel of Jesus Christ and not on any man made religion.

LeopoldBloom · M

@GodSpeed63 If that's the case, show me where in this country's founding documents it says that it was founded on the "Gospel of Jesus Christ." By the way, all religion is man-made including that one.

The Declaration of Independence also doesn't mention "God," "Jesus," or "Christianity." It mentions a "creator" which is a general term that any Theist would use, be they Jewish, Christian, Muslim, or Scientologist, and "nature's God," a specifically Deist term, not surprising since the writer of the Declaration of Independence, Thomas Jefferson, was not a Christian, but a Deist. Deists believe that a God created the universe, then left it and took no further interest in it, so Deism is inimical to Christianity which holds that God is intimately involved in his creation.

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