Do you feel like religious people are unfairly judged? [Spirituality & Religion]

Christianity is not based on a set of rules@LithiumDrop

@Speedyman Religions are rules based. If you don't follow the rules, you go to hell.

@Speedyman You got that right! I wish people understood this.

@BittersweetPotato Our modern world is not exempt from the restraints of the law. That's how we keep peace and justice. Try to, anyway. There are always those who tempt and abuse the system. With no rules at all, there would be nothing but confusion and chaos. Same goes for those who follow Christ, and I'm not talking about "religious people". Anyone can be religious, but religion didn't die on the cross for our sins. Jesus did. That makes a willful fellowship with Him, personal, and it is woefully incorrect to assume that all followers of Christ must obey the rules out of fear, or they will go to hell. Nothing could be further from the truth. We are saved by grace, which is defined as [b]unearned favor[/b] from God. We don't have to be or do [b]good[/b], in order to find favor with God. Further, accepting Jesus as our Savior was something we weren't forced to do, nor [i]forced[/i] to follow a strict set of rules in order to be accepted by Jesus. Just like society has limitations, so does following the Lord, and rightly so. However, contrary to belief, Christians do not follow Christ out of fear, but we are obedient to Him out of love for Him and what He has done for us. Further, we are "sealed" by the Holy Spirit, until we go home to be with Him, in heaven. Under the law of [b]grace[/b], we are not damned to hell every time we sin. Christ's one time sacrifice satisfied our sin debt, once and for all. That does not give any believer the license to sin. Rather, it allows those who truly love the Lord, to show Him how much we love Him.

@LadyGrace Do you seriously think that it is a sensible thing to say that people do not have to do good, but only believe that Jesus died for their sins and that's enough to go to heaven or be rewarded? What is the good or logic in that? What a very comforting concept, but it is incredibly dangerous nonsensical. You keep making distinction between following Jesus and following religion, both are pretty much the same. If you are having trouble comprehending the difference, think of religion as a marketing tool for Jesus, this is all it really is.

@BittersweetPotato You're not understanding what I'm saying. The distinction is that while doing good is certainly a good trait, Jesus said that doing good is not what saves a person. He said we cannot [i]get to heaven[/i] by doing good works. Big difference. Good works are important, but they won't save anyone. The [i]importance[/i] of good works, [i]as far as Jesus and salvation are concerned, comes [u]after[/u] one is saved. But even then, they still have nothing to do with getting to heaven. Jesus said so in His Word. Thank God, we don't have to be perfect before we can come to Jesus, nor be accepted according to our performance, in order to be saved. He accepts us just as we are right now....sins and all. And no...following some religious group is not the same as accepting Jesus as one's personal Savior. Not at all. Take all the religions in the world away, and it still boils down to one thing only .... our own personal relationship with Jesus. Whether we have accepted Him as our Savior, or not. The distinction between religions and Jesus, is that religion is defined only as man-made philosophy. Knowing Jesus means having a personal relationship with Him. Huge difference. Religion didn't die on the cross for our sins. Jesus did.

@LadyGrace Well thanks for explaining, but my initial understanding was right. Basing our rewards on accepting Jesus and not on our good deeds and qualities isn't really a nice thing. and doesn't make a lot of sense. So I accept jesus as my savor and then I go and do all the horrible things in the world and I still go to heaven. Whereas, someone else may not accept him, yet have had such a positive impact on the world and benefited it a lot of people, and still go to hell. What is the logic or fairness in that.

@BittersweetPotato [quote]thanks for explaining, but my initial understanding was right. Basing our rewards on accepting Jesus and not on our good deeds and qualities isn't really a nice thing. and doesn't make a lot of sense. So I accept jesus as my savor and then I go and do all the horrible things in the world and I still go to heaven. Whereas, someone else may not accept him, yet have had such a positive impact on the world and benefited it a lot of people, and still go to hell. What is the logic or fairness in that.[/quote]

Your initial understanding is incorrect and you're trying to lean on your own understanding, when God's Word clearly teaches the opposite. Plus, Christians never base the need for salvation, on rewards. God cannot be fooled. He knows people's hearts. The rest of your theories are inaccurate as well. I already mentioned that being saved does not give one a license to sin. A true follower of God does not deliberately go out and sin or do all the horrible things in the world. That makes no sense at all.

Forget about having a license to sin because that’s not what i said or meant... but let’s look at the other side; someone with great ethics and good works, have benefited humanity and done very well in their life but they don’t believe in Jesus and they are still doing a lot of good and a lot better than those who do believe ... Don’t they deserve heaven?!!! Why link the concept of rewards to something that i think is superficial which is that jesus died for us thousands years ago rather than something practical, meaningful and can be touched, which is that this person was able to make a positive change in the world.. But hey, you are not alone.. Islam also makes the same link, FYI! To go heaven, you need to believe that there is no god but Allah and that Mohamed is the prophet of Allah. Well... @LadyGrace

@BittersweetPotato Islam's beliefs are far from my own and other Christian's beliefs. Further, your philosophy with how to be saved, does not match up with the God's Word.

But it [b]is[/b] what you said, only in a different way. You said..."So I accept jesus as my savor and then I go and do all the horrible things in the world and I still go to heaven." Same meaning. I understand your philosophy about doing good. However, when it comes to [i]salvation[/i], that concept doesn't work that way, in the [i]spiritual world.[/i] Here's why.

If we could save ourselves, we wouldn't need Jesus. God the Father, appointed Jesus as our spiritual Mediator between us and His Father. Why do we need a mediator? Because obviously, God is Spirit. Therefore, we needed a [i]spiritual[/i] guide to tell us how to get to heaven when we die, so we don't end up in the wrong place...hell. We are [u]all[/u] in the same boat, spiritually, the bible points out. That is, our sins separate us from God the Father. Left in that condition, we remain without fellowship with God. That needs to be restored, through prayer and forgiveness of our sins.

When we ask Jesus to forgive us of our sins, we are justified [b]not[/b] by OUR works (Romans 3:20), but by the work of Jesus’ death and resurrection (Romans 4:25) on the cross, that paid for our sins. Faith itself is not a “good work” that causes God to take notice of us. Faith is repenting of our sin, admitting that we are spiritually lost and unable to do anything to save ourselves, then simply accepting the free gift of salvation He offers.

Romans 8:1 - "There is therefore now NO CONDEMNATION to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit."

Jesus never came to condemn the world, but to save it. Otherwise, he wouldn't have suffered so horribly on the cross, if we could save ourselves. But he volunteered to do that, just so we could have a way to eternal life in heaven. That's how much He loves us. He could have left us in our sins, to go to hell, but he didn't. He not only said he loves us, he proved it. With his life.

What one has to do to be saved, is accept that Jesus died for your/our sins, and ask His forgiveness. Then turn from your sins to a new life in Christ — that’s called repentance. Jesus Christ knows us and loves us. What matters to Him is the attitude of our heart, our honesty, and commitment.

@LadyGrace You didn't answer my simple question.

someone with great ethics and good works, have benefited humanity and done very well in their life but they don’t believe in Jesus and they are still doing a lot of good and a lot better than those who do believe ... Don’t they deserve heaven?!!!

Don't they? Do they deserve to go to hell just because they didn't believe in Jesus and regardless of all the good that they've done?

@BittersweetPotato I answered your question perfectly. You just need to read what I write. And, Islam's beliefs are far from my own and other Christian's beliefs. Further, your philosophy with how to be saved, does not match up with the God's Word. Are you smarter than God or know better?

@LadyGrace Where is the answer in what you've written? Why don't you be specific about my question?

@BittersweetPotato I know you didn't read my answer that fast, as you were back with me in less than a minute, so this tells me you just want to argue and not listen. So I'll answer that again. God is all for doing good, yet when it comes to salvation, the key is this: Jesus said, in the spiritual sense, [u]none[/u] of us are "good". That is, we have ALL sinned and [u]come short[/u] of [b]God's standard[/b] when it comes to being good. We don't set that standard...God does, and no amount of manipulating His standard or trying to bend the rules, shall suffice. In the spiritual world, sin is such an offense, because it separates us from God forever, as His creation, so yes, He takes that personally. He does not hate US....He hates SIN. God is fair....Sin is not. And because it cost Him his very life, yes, sin is a serious offense. He didn't HAVE to try and make a way out for us. But He did. Or would you rather the alternative, that He left us in our sins, eternally separated from Him, in hell? I'm very honored and grateful that He paid the price for my sins, so I could be forgiven and live in restored fellowship with God in heaven, forever.

@LadyGrace In simple words, the answer to my question is; If you do good, but don't believe in Jesus, you are somehow still not considered a good person, and therefore, you go to hell. And FYI this is considered fair.

@BittersweetPotato You're still trying to manipulate God to your own reasoning. Jesus loves us. His love is not conditional. He loves us, no matter what, but not our sin. And we all have it. It separates us from God, regardless of how good we think we are. That needs to be remedied through Jesus, through the forgiveness of our sins, so we can be brought back to fellowship with God. What's so hard about that? Jesus did the hard part [u]for[/u] us, so we wouldn't have to pay the penalty for sin with our life. Jesus did that for us. He did what we [u]cannot[/u] do, because it takes a pure, sinless blood sacrifice, in order to have our sins forgiven. Jesus is the only one who qualified for that, because He [u]had no sin.[/u] He is perfect and cannot sin.

[c=#BF0000][b]Jesus said...[/b][/c]

Now. Are you going to argue with Him? Or would you like your sins forgiven, so you're no longer separated from God the Father?

@BittersweetPotato No. You don't go to hell because you're good or bad. You go to hell because your sins separate you from God, which is remedied through the forgiveness of your sins, by Jesus.

@LadyGrace Hell is in our minds. People who know that are not afraid of death.

@Elevatorpitches Hell is a very real place, described in detail in the bible. If you don't believe that, that's up to you, but I believe God's Word.

@LadyGrace "God" tells me I'm ok what what I know and also ok with what I still have to learn.

OK?

Judge not lest YOU be judged.