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@Kwek00 I never understood that. How in the world are you supposed to believe more? Belief is pretty black and white. You either believe something is true or you don't. The only time such a thing would apply is when you are unsure. But didn't Jesus say faith the size of a mustard seed?
It's almost like faith/belief is treated as a currency. Cause I was promised I could move mountains with only a little faith. You think the people that heard that would have actually went out and tried it like I did. The hills are all still in place though.
I guess they had to create the idea of "more faith" for when it would inevitably fail.
It's almost like faith/belief is treated as a currency. Cause I was promised I could move mountains with only a little faith. You think the people that heard that would have actually went out and tried it like I did. The hills are all still in place though.
I guess they had to create the idea of "more faith" for when it would inevitably fail.
Kwek00 · 41-45, M
@canusernamebemyusername
Well... if you can't make the mountain crash itself into the sea. You are just not believing hard enough. On the other side, you also have the other problem, which Jesus faced in the desert. Matthew 4:5-7 reads:
[quote]5 Then the devil took him to the holy city and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. 6 “If you are the Son of God,” he said, “throw yourself down. For it is written:
“‘He will command his angels concerning you,
and they will lift you up in their hands,
so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.’[c]”
7 Jesus answered him, “It is also written: ‘Do not put the Lord your God to the test.[/quote]
So maybe you do believe enough (enough is always so abritrary) but it's damnable to put your lord to the test (which in this case is testing your faith).
Annyway... the entire text protects itself pretty well on trying to figure out if God is actually real.
Well... if you can't make the mountain crash itself into the sea. You are just not believing hard enough. On the other side, you also have the other problem, which Jesus faced in the desert. Matthew 4:5-7 reads:
[quote]5 Then the devil took him to the holy city and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. 6 “If you are the Son of God,” he said, “throw yourself down. For it is written:
“‘He will command his angels concerning you,
and they will lift you up in their hands,
so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.’[c]”
7 Jesus answered him, “It is also written: ‘Do not put the Lord your God to the test.[/quote]
So maybe you do believe enough (enough is always so abritrary) but it's damnable to put your lord to the test (which in this case is testing your faith).
Annyway... the entire text protects itself pretty well on trying to figure out if God is actually real.
@Kwek00 The whole testing people even though he is omniscient is just bizarre to me. Works better if he is not all knowing. Although there is a hint that he might not know everything.
"[i]The LORD regretted that he had made human beings on the earth, and his heart was deeply troubled.[/i]
He already knew he was going to regret it?!
"[i]The LORD regretted that he had made human beings on the earth, and his heart was deeply troubled.[/i]
He already knew he was going to regret it?!
Kwek00 · 41-45, M
@canusernamebemyusername Yeah... He changes his mind too in that storyline. That's from the second part of Genesis right? The entire moment where he decides to kill of humanity with flood? The omnipotent part there is also really strange, you would think you can just snap your fingers and let humanity die off while protecting the animals. But the entire drama with the arc makes a great story.
It's also that he decides in the beginning of the story that humanity is totally doomed and cursed. BUT at the end of the story, Noah is seen as a righteous man (so suddenly Noah becomes the exception to the norm set out in the first part of the story)
but again... great literature. I love this stuff. I just don't make a religion out of it.
It's also that he decides in the beginning of the story that humanity is totally doomed and cursed. BUT at the end of the story, Noah is seen as a righteous man (so suddenly Noah becomes the exception to the norm set out in the first part of the story)
but again... great literature. I love this stuff. I just don't make a religion out of it.
@Kwek00 I agree. I really like Genesis actually. It is fun to take apart and see how it works and is put together. lol
I was just thinking that omniscient might have been misapplied. Cause technically when humanity ate of the tree of knowledge we obtained all knowledge as well. The devil even says we were then like God knowing all things. According to some translations at least.
Cause the tree of knowledge of good and evil I have heard is a Jewish storytelling technique. Where two opposite things are put together, in this case good and evil, to mean everything in between. So the tree of knowledge of good and evil can be translated as tree of all knowledge. Which should make us omniscient as well.
So maybe the terms got mixed up and omniscient originally meant just having all knowledge but not being clairvoyant.
Just a thought I had. lol
I was just thinking that omniscient might have been misapplied. Cause technically when humanity ate of the tree of knowledge we obtained all knowledge as well. The devil even says we were then like God knowing all things. According to some translations at least.
Cause the tree of knowledge of good and evil I have heard is a Jewish storytelling technique. Where two opposite things are put together, in this case good and evil, to mean everything in between. So the tree of knowledge of good and evil can be translated as tree of all knowledge. Which should make us omniscient as well.
So maybe the terms got mixed up and omniscient originally meant just having all knowledge but not being clairvoyant.
Just a thought I had. lol
GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M
@Kwek00 [quote]Of course... if all things are not possible, you just don't believe enough.[/quote]
All things are possible with God but not all things are beneficial to us at His discretion.
All things are possible with God but not all things are beneficial to us at His discretion.
Kwek00 · 41-45, M
@GodSpeed63 I believe we already established that you aren't really searching for "truth" right? You just want to get into heaven following the path set out that you believe to be right? So how honest can your assertions be, if you freely admit to be biased and uncritical with the intention of reaching a perceived goal?
GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M
@Kwek00 [quote]I believe we already established that you aren't really searching for "truth" right[/quote]
No, it is you aren't really searching for truth.
No, it is you aren't really searching for truth.
Kwek00 · 41-45, M
@GodSpeed63
We had a conversation months ago... and I asked you if you were advocating for ignorance because you wouldn't even consider looking at the problem from another angle. You had no problem confirming that. I'll have to delve deep if I need to find that conversation again, but I'm pretty sure it's out there unless it's in a story written by Speedyman who blocked me.
I kinda respected that opinion, because at least you were being honest about it. I have a way more problems with people that want to make reality conform to scientific proof or actual facts. Those people are dishonest. But in that conversation you made it clear you weren't about that, and you just wanted to believe.
A person with that opinion, is impossible to have an honest discussion with on the toppic they aren't even willing to annalyse. For people that think like that, the believe is a rock and they build their church on that rock. No problem, but going into discussions with people that are hardcore determined to know everything, is just useless.
I totally disregarded anny statements you made from that moment of thing I didn't like, because I considered you a "lost cause" when it comes to trying to figure things out. Because you are not trying to figure things out, you are trying to impose your believes on others. Things aren't open for discussion, I just need to listen accept. There are no arguments only dictates. So why are we trying to dictate things now? And why am I'm not intrested in the truth, while you are the person that throws anny argument under the bus before looking into it, just because it doesnt stroke with your believes?
We had a conversation months ago... and I asked you if you were advocating for ignorance because you wouldn't even consider looking at the problem from another angle. You had no problem confirming that. I'll have to delve deep if I need to find that conversation again, but I'm pretty sure it's out there unless it's in a story written by Speedyman who blocked me.
I kinda respected that opinion, because at least you were being honest about it. I have a way more problems with people that want to make reality conform to scientific proof or actual facts. Those people are dishonest. But in that conversation you made it clear you weren't about that, and you just wanted to believe.
A person with that opinion, is impossible to have an honest discussion with on the toppic they aren't even willing to annalyse. For people that think like that, the believe is a rock and they build their church on that rock. No problem, but going into discussions with people that are hardcore determined to know everything, is just useless.
I totally disregarded anny statements you made from that moment of thing I didn't like, because I considered you a "lost cause" when it comes to trying to figure things out. Because you are not trying to figure things out, you are trying to impose your believes on others. Things aren't open for discussion, I just need to listen accept. There are no arguments only dictates. So why are we trying to dictate things now? And why am I'm not intrested in the truth, while you are the person that throws anny argument under the bus before looking into it, just because it doesnt stroke with your believes?
GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M
@Kwek00 [quote]Because you are not trying to figure things out, you are trying to impose your believes on others. Things aren't open for discussion, I just need to listen accept. There are no arguments only dictates. So why are we trying to dictate things now? And why am I'm not intrested in the truth, while you are the person that throws anny argument under the bus before looking into it, just because it doesnt stroke with your believes?[/quote]
It's not what I believe is true, it's what God Says in His Word is true. He is not a man that He is capable of lying or being in error.
It's not what I believe is true, it's what God Says in His Word is true. He is not a man that He is capable of lying or being in error.
Kwek00 · 41-45, M
@GodSpeed63 Yeah, well... you even have to have a pretty biased read of the bible if you think that he never made an error and all.
Even after the first chapter, He's already moaning about how bad his creation has become, and that humanity has to be eradicated from the earth. And then later on, he changes his mind on that too, and let Noah and his descendants live. Noah went from being a damned soul to a good soul that walks with good.
God is pretty conflicted. But because people like yourself want things, and feel things need to be just like you want. You are incapable of even looking at the other side. And since you are more then just incapable, you are even unwilling to look at it in a critcal way, because of your feelings and because of your wants like, we all have to listen to your version of the story that you romantisiced so it fits the perfect little narrative you want it to be. That's biased and dishonest as fuck (as I often point out) but you don't care because you embraced the idea that being ignorant will get you where you want to be. And since you actively and conciously embrace ignorance, you are just not worth having a conversation with on this toppic 🤷♂️. You are probably great in other areas, but when it comes to religion you are a concious biased ignoramus that just wants things to be like you want them to be. 🤷♂️
Even after the first chapter, He's already moaning about how bad his creation has become, and that humanity has to be eradicated from the earth. And then later on, he changes his mind on that too, and let Noah and his descendants live. Noah went from being a damned soul to a good soul that walks with good.
God is pretty conflicted. But because people like yourself want things, and feel things need to be just like you want. You are incapable of even looking at the other side. And since you are more then just incapable, you are even unwilling to look at it in a critcal way, because of your feelings and because of your wants like, we all have to listen to your version of the story that you romantisiced so it fits the perfect little narrative you want it to be. That's biased and dishonest as fuck (as I often point out) but you don't care because you embraced the idea that being ignorant will get you where you want to be. And since you actively and conciously embrace ignorance, you are just not worth having a conversation with on this toppic 🤷♂️. You are probably great in other areas, but when it comes to religion you are a concious biased ignoramus that just wants things to be like you want them to be. 🤷♂️
GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M
@Kwek00 [quote]Yeah, well... you even have to have a pretty biased read of the bible if you think that he never made an error and all. [/quote]
No. His Spirit dwells within me and converses with my spirit the truth of God's Word since I became born again in spirit. This may sound foolish to you but it's still the truth. test it for yourself and become born again in spirit.
No. His Spirit dwells within me and converses with my spirit the truth of God's Word since I became born again in spirit. This may sound foolish to you but it's still the truth. test it for yourself and become born again in spirit.
Kwek00 · 41-45, M
@GodSpeed63 Well, the assylum is full of people that also believe a lot of stuff godspeed. From Napoleon to Hitler... you can all find them in a rooms full of cushions.
GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M
@Kwek00 [quote]Well, the asylum is full of people that also believe a lot of stuff godspeed.[/quote]
How do you know, are you one of them?
How do you know, are you one of them?
GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M
@Kwek00 [quote]Another one of those great quotes, that can never be wrong.[/quote]
You're barking up the wrong tree. It's Prophesies from the Word that will be fulfilled and not self prophesies.
[quote]Well, the assylum is full of people that also believe a lot of stuff[/quote]
Including skeptics, like yourself.
You're barking up the wrong tree. It's Prophesies from the Word that will be fulfilled and not self prophesies.
[quote]Well, the assylum is full of people that also believe a lot of stuff[/quote]
Including skeptics, like yourself.
Kwek00 · 41-45, M
@GodSpeed63 Not really Godspeed. There are certain prophecies in the book, that are so ambiguous, that they always work out. It's like reading a horoscope.
Of course, rational people go insane too sometimes. They ussually loose their rational 😅
Of course, rational people go insane too sometimes. They ussually loose their rational 😅
GodSpeed63 · 61-69, M
@Kwek00 [quote]There are certain prophecies in the book, that are so ambiguous, that they always work out. [/quote]
Such as?
[quote]Of course, rational people go insane too sometimes. [/quote]
Yeah, some Christians do go insane at times.
Such as?
[quote]Of course, rational people go insane too sometimes. [/quote]
Yeah, some Christians do go insane at times.
Kwek00 · 41-45, M
@GodSpeed63 All things are possible to those that trully believe.
hippyjoe1955 · 61-69, M
@Kwek00 There is a huge difference between possible and going to happen.
Kwek00 · 41-45, M
@hippyjoe1955 🤣🤣🤣