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CheekyBadger · M
Up unto the 70s there were only two genders as "sex" and "gender" were synomyms but a psychologist (can't remember which one) redefined gender to mean something different (and this new definition seems to have been accepted) hence why we are where we are.
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CheekyBadger · M
@Torsten indeed -I don't agree with this redefining existing words to mean something else process that seems to be becoming more common. E.g. in 2020 the webster dictionary (I think) redefined "anti-vaxxer" to mean someone opposed to mandatory vaccines which isn't what it meant at all. However because it is in a dictionary it can be presented as evidence in court that that is the accepted definition (should the need arise- perhaps in a defamation law suit).
Gloomy · F
@CheekyBadger Language has always been changing and evolving because it reflects society and new found findings as well as actively shapes our reality.
CheekyBadger · M
@Gloomy It does - but tends to be in a more natural way, what we are seeing now is a specific group of people, with an axe to grind, stating that the definition has changed and in some cases literally changing it in the dictionary but the change doesn't reflect the way most people use it. The English language evolves through usage - there is no-one in control (compared so say French where the "Academie Francais" controls it).
If we look back, for example the word man didn't refer to the male sex specifically - it covered both sexes equally - and we see this reflected in words like "mankind" which still means both males and females. The word "woman" was a later addition and after this appeared the word "man" began to be used to refer to just male sex. Where we have usages that haven't changed over time (e.g. the bible) people who don't know better assume that the modern usage is what was meant and complain that the bible is sexist - which of course it isn't it's just that the modern understanding is out of line with what was there when the translation to English was made.
If we look back, for example the word man didn't refer to the male sex specifically - it covered both sexes equally - and we see this reflected in words like "mankind" which still means both males and females. The word "woman" was a later addition and after this appeared the word "man" began to be used to refer to just male sex. Where we have usages that haven't changed over time (e.g. the bible) people who don't know better assume that the modern usage is what was meant and complain that the bible is sexist - which of course it isn't it's just that the modern understanding is out of line with what was there when the translation to English was made.
Gloomy · F
@CheekyBadger I would disagree with your first statement. In my original reply to the main post here I cited a scientific article of an evolutionary biologist. There is not necessarily a specific group behind change but the group affected by it is now speaking up and is heard after centuries of repression. Also what is considered "natural" or "traditional" are just constructs and never have been static parts of society. Biologically we don't change according to a set plan but rather through adaption to our environment.
Well no one is in control even if academic research changes definition whether or not those definitions are used is up to the individuals and puplic discourses.
People who criticise the Bible are very well aware in which historic context it was written. But viewing it from our society today it's nothing but an old document. People calling it sexist are arguing against people who want religious influence in society.
Well no one is in control even if academic research changes definition whether or not those definitions are used is up to the individuals and puplic discourses.
People who criticise the Bible are very well aware in which historic context it was written. But viewing it from our society today it's nothing but an old document. People calling it sexist are arguing against people who want religious influence in society.
CheekyBadger · M
@Gloomy sorry - I should have been more specific - in my first paragraph I wasn't referring specifically to the current trans debate but in the wider so called "culture-wars" context - this pattern is repeated across different debates. Redefining the language is a common tool that is deployed.
Gloomy · F
@CheekyBadger Sure certain language is used in specific contexts and extending meaning or slightly changing a meaning does not redefine it entirely and neither is it such a bad thing.
As someone who isn't from the US the "Culture War" can be viewed in two ways.
As something ridiculous and embarrassing where people rather complain about "woke" (a term that has so many different meanings now) sweets instead of talking about actual policies
And as something the right has weaponized, scaring people who tend to be more "traditional" into thinking their world is being ripped apart by creating fake narratives like the "grooming gays" one which is very stupid.
In Europe there are minor discourses about these issues but no such silly culture war.
As someone who isn't from the US the "Culture War" can be viewed in two ways.
As something ridiculous and embarrassing where people rather complain about "woke" (a term that has so many different meanings now) sweets instead of talking about actual policies
And as something the right has weaponized, scaring people who tend to be more "traditional" into thinking their world is being ripped apart by creating fake narratives like the "grooming gays" one which is very stupid.
In Europe there are minor discourses about these issues but no such silly culture war.
Gloomy · F
@Budwick Such a silly mind you have.
Some examples would be the term "woke". It's frequent use shapes discourse which has an affect on how people think, argue and behave.
Also:
Some examples would be the term "woke". It's frequent use shapes discourse which has an affect on how people think, argue and behave.
Also:
“Language is our way of encoding regularities in our environment,” says Eamon Walsh, a neuroscientist at King’s College in London. Because we encode our experiences of the world through language, it has the power to highlight or augment certain phenomena — while simultaneously de-emphasizing other phenomena.
Gloomy · F
@Budwick Current research confirms the existence of a relationship between language and the way we perceive the world. The way we perceive impacts our actions. We communicate how we see the world through language. Reality can only be perceived through a person therefore language plays a big role in the way reality is shaped.
Gloomy · F
@Budwick
On nearly every continent, and for all of recorded history, thriving cultures have recognized, revered, and integrated more than two genders. Terms such as transgender and gay are strictly new constructs that assume three things: that there are only two sexes (male/female), as many as two sexualities (gay/straight), and only two genders (man/woman).
Yet hundreds of distinct societies around the globe have their own long-established traditions for third, fourth, fifth, or more genders. The subject of Two Spirits, Fred Martinez, for example, was not a boy who wanted to be a girl, but both a boy and a girl — an identity his Navajo culture recognized and revered as nádleehí. Meanwhile, Hina of Kumu Hina is part of a native Hawaiian culture that has traditionally revered and respected mahu, those who embody both male and female spirit.
Most Western societies have no direct correlation for this tradition, nor for the many other communities without strict either/or conceptions of sex, sexuality, and gender. Worldwide, the sheer variety of gender expression is almost limitless. Take a tour and learn how other cultures see gender diversity.
Yet hundreds of distinct societies around the globe have their own long-established traditions for third, fourth, fifth, or more genders. The subject of Two Spirits, Fred Martinez, for example, was not a boy who wanted to be a girl, but both a boy and a girl — an identity his Navajo culture recognized and revered as nádleehí. Meanwhile, Hina of Kumu Hina is part of a native Hawaiian culture that has traditionally revered and respected mahu, those who embody both male and female spirit.
Most Western societies have no direct correlation for this tradition, nor for the many other communities without strict either/or conceptions of sex, sexuality, and gender. Worldwide, the sheer variety of gender expression is almost limitless. Take a tour and learn how other cultures see gender diversity.
Gloomy · F
@Budwick Have you read and understood my whole quote?
Also Gender is the range of characteristics pertaining to, and differentiating between masculinity and femininity. Depending on the context, these characteristics may include biological sex (i.e. the state of being male, female or an intersex variation which may complicate sex assignment), sex-based social structures (including gender roles and other social roles), or gender identity).
Also Gender is the range of characteristics pertaining to, and differentiating between masculinity and femininity. Depending on the context, these characteristics may include biological sex (i.e. the state of being male, female or an intersex variation which may complicate sex assignment), sex-based social structures (including gender roles and other social roles), or gender identity).
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