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SatanBurger · 36-40, F
@Waveney there was a woman that was stalked and viciously pursued by a weirdo conservative politician because she crossed state lines to have an abortion. He followed her relentlessly like a slaver and even found the hospitals she visited
So it might as well be a federal ban
So it might as well be a federal ban
Diotrephes · 70-79, M
@Northwest
Congress could pass a federal law allowing abortions if the people wanted it. And such a law could also prohibit all courts, including the SCOTUS, from interfering with it.
You're a little over 4 years too late. The U.S. Supreme Court overturned Roe v. Wade on June 24, 2022, in the ruling Dobbs v. Jackson Women's Health Organization.
Congress could pass a federal law allowing abortions if the people wanted it. And such a law could also prohibit all courts, including the SCOTUS, from interfering with it.
ElwoodBlues · M
Let's start by looking at what happened afer Dobbs. The 2022 Dobbs ruling left abortion up to the states, and abortion was immediately banned in 13 states. The result was a slight increase in abortions after Dobbs.
The fact is, most Americans don't consider a first trimester abortion to be in any way criminal. And so people continue to have first trimester abortions, and if they live in an anti-abortion state, they find ways around the ban.
All Dobbs did was create a nation of scofflaws. Just like prohibition in the 1930s. Dobbs didn't work. Not even a little bit. Most Americans don't consider a first trimester abortion to be in any way criminal, and they continue to act accordingly.
https://www.guttmacher.org/fact-sheet/induced-abortion-united-states
Interesting info on who is getting abortions when. 92% occur in the first trimester; they are very rare beyond the 2nd trimester.
So if the abortion bans are not reducing abortions, what effects have they had in the states with bans?? The answer here is grim.
Women in Texas experienced a 56% rise in maternal mortality when Texas' new abortion law went into effect prior to Dobbs.
That new Texas law, SB 8, allows MANY more people to sue a doctor who provides that kind of care. It created an "open season" on doctors. Almost any busybody can sue a doctor under SB 8.
The fact is, most Americans don't consider a first trimester abortion to be in any way criminal. And so people continue to have first trimester abortions, and if they live in an anti-abortion state, they find ways around the ban.
All Dobbs did was create a nation of scofflaws. Just like prohibition in the 1930s. Dobbs didn't work. Not even a little bit. Most Americans don't consider a first trimester abortion to be in any way criminal, and they continue to act accordingly.
Interesting info on who is getting abortions when. 92% occur in the first trimester; they are very rare beyond the 2nd trimester.
So if the abortion bans are not reducing abortions, what effects have they had in the states with bans?? The answer here is grim.
Women in Texas experienced a 56% rise in maternal mortality when Texas' new abortion law went into effect prior to Dobbs.
That new Texas law, SB 8, allows MANY more people to sue a doctor who provides that kind of care. It created an "open season" on doctors. Almost any busybody can sue a doctor under SB 8.
And what it found was a 56% rise in maternal mortality in the state of Texas from the year 2019 to 2022. That's notable because it's compared to just an 11% rise in maternal mortality nationwide in the same time period. And the time period is important because 2019 is our last glimpse of life before the pandemic. We know that the entire country saw a maternal mortality spike during the pandemic.
But the thing that was really different here: Texas stood out in that it had SB 8. And we know SB 8 passed an entire year before Dobbs. That was the biggest difference between Texas and the other states that did not see such a major rise in maternal mortality.
[b] https://www.texasstandard.org/stories/texas-maternal-mortality-rate-rises-abortion-ban[/b ]But the thing that was really different here: Texas stood out in that it had SB 8. And we know SB 8 passed an entire year before Dobbs. That was the biggest difference between Texas and the other states that did not see such a major rise in maternal mortality.
ElwoodBlues · M
@sree251 Nope. I know that abortion during the first trimester is fine. You have the right to your own opinions, beliefs, religions, and philosophies. you have NO right to attempt to impose them on me.
BTW, the founding fathers knew about abortion (Ben Franklin even published instructions) and they chose not to ban it in the Constitution. At the time, folks identified the beginning of life with "the quickening." Thus, abortion before "the quickening" has ALWAYS been Constitutional. It's a matter of simple historical fact.
BTW, I see you STILL haven't asked your AI about the effects of anti-abortion laws such as what I outlined in Texas after SB-8. It's literally killing pregnant women. Don't you care???
BTW, the founding fathers knew about abortion (Ben Franklin even published instructions) and they chose not to ban it in the Constitution. At the time, folks identified the beginning of life with "the quickening." Thus, abortion before "the quickening" has ALWAYS been Constitutional. It's a matter of simple historical fact.
BTW, I see you STILL haven't asked your AI about the effects of anti-abortion laws such as what I outlined in Texas after SB-8. It's literally killing pregnant women. Don't you care???
sree251 · 46-50, M
@ElwoodBlues
Abortion during the first trimester is fine? How many abortions have you foisted on the women you screwed? By "screwed" I meant fooled. This is not a thing responsible men do, Elwood.
Nope. I know that abortion during the first trimester is fine. You have the right to your own opinions, beliefs, religions, and philosophies. you have NO right to attempt to impose them on me.
Abortion during the first trimester is fine? How many abortions have you foisted on the women you screwed? By "screwed" I meant fooled. This is not a thing responsible men do, Elwood.
ElwoodBlues · M
@sree251 Never. Not once. You have the right to your own opinions, beliefs, religions, and philosophies. you have NO right to attempt to impose them on me.
BTW, the founding fathers knew about abortion (Ben Franklin even published instructions) and they chose not to ban it in the Constitution. At the time, folks identified the beginning of life with "the quickening." Thus, abortion before "the quickening" has ALWAYS been Constitutional. It's a matter of simple historical fact.
BTW, the founding fathers knew about abortion (Ben Franklin even published instructions) and they chose not to ban it in the Constitution. At the time, folks identified the beginning of life with "the quickening." Thus, abortion before "the quickening" has ALWAYS been Constitutional. It's a matter of simple historical fact.
SatanBurger · 36-40, F
The main reason I say no is because abortion bans and anti abortion laws are often associated with lack of women's health care and maternal care in developing worlds who also have religious theocratic laws. The same will happen to the US because it's all linked. Those that are ignorant on the subject of abortion also don't support women's health so with the disappearance of abortion is also going to be the disappearance on women's health. Almost every country that has abortion bans also have higher infant and women all cause mortality rates. To look at the future consequences, you got to look at pro lifers overall views of women, religion, health and rights in general to know what it is like.
In the US, with anti abortion laws we already have higher maternal death rates among all developed countries. It wouldn't be like this if we had abortion plus lower child care cost, affordable health and better public services as well as free contraceptives and overall focus on health.
Also, pregnancy is super high risk. There's 300 diseases that can develop while pregnant not to mention mental illness. Pregnancy is extremely high risk and many women who get abortion one time, doesn't mean they don't have kids in the future. It's for this reason that highly ignorant people shouldn't be in charge of our abortion laws because they know little.
In the US, with anti abortion laws we already have higher maternal death rates among all developed countries. It wouldn't be like this if we had abortion plus lower child care cost, affordable health and better public services as well as free contraceptives and overall focus on health.
Also, pregnancy is super high risk. There's 300 diseases that can develop while pregnant not to mention mental illness. Pregnancy is extremely high risk and many women who get abortion one time, doesn't mean they don't have kids in the future. It's for this reason that highly ignorant people shouldn't be in charge of our abortion laws because they know little.
newjaninev2 · 56-60, F
@Adstar and how has american society moved to eliminate school shootings?
Shutting down firearm retailers, perhaps?
No
Requiring very strict control of all firearms in the home - and sweeping powers to enforce that?
No
Strict checks and delays on the sale of firearms and ammunition?
No
Banning seni-automatic weapons?
No
Just a quick 'candlelight vigil' after every school shooting and a few days of 'something must be done'
Shutting down firearm retailers, perhaps?
No
Requiring very strict control of all firearms in the home - and sweeping powers to enforce that?
No
Strict checks and delays on the sale of firearms and ammunition?
No
Banning seni-automatic weapons?
No
Just a quick 'candlelight vigil' after every school shooting and a few days of 'something must be done'
Adstar · 56-60, M
@newjaninev2 Another one who thinks everyone in SW are Americans.. I'm not an American. US domestic policy's is in the hands of Americans.. Not me.. And as far as i know there is a wide variety of different gun policies in different states and cities across the USA.. So you cannot declare all the USA to have the same policies..
Roundandroundwego · 61-69
They're pulling out uteruses cuz dead foetus is more beloved than live lady in USA!!!
ElwoodBlues · M
@justbob says
The fact is, most Americans don't consider a first trimester abortion to be in any way criminal. And so people continue to have first trimester abortions, and if they live in an anti-abortion state, they find ways around the ban.
All Dobbs did was create a nation of scofflaws. Just like prohibition in the 1930s. Dobbs didn't work. Not even a little bit. Most Americans don't consider a first trimester abortion to be in any way criminal, and they continue to act accordingly.
https://www.guttmacher.org/fact-sheet/induced-abortion-united-states
Fewer dead babies and those who would commit such
That's what you guys said about the 2022 Dobbs ruling that left abortion up to the states when abortion was banned in 13 states. And what did happen, bob?? Nationwide, abortion rates are up slightly since Dobbs. The fact is, most Americans don't consider a first trimester abortion to be in any way criminal. And so people continue to have first trimester abortions, and if they live in an anti-abortion state, they find ways around the ban.
All Dobbs did was create a nation of scofflaws. Just like prohibition in the 1930s. Dobbs didn't work. Not even a little bit. Most Americans don't consider a first trimester abortion to be in any way criminal, and they continue to act accordingly.
Diotrephes · 70-79, M
Imagine that in a State that bans abortions if countless pregnant women simply committed suicide. Would the control freaks change their minds as a consequence? After all, if the parents have the unwanted kids they will simply kill them at some time in the future. It happens more and more every day.
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sree251 · 46-50, M
@Subsumedpat Why ask the woman? Is she the one holding the bag?
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Rabbit420 · M
@MoveAlong Especially if it's a fetus that was created by rape or incest!!!! Of course there are all these Pro-lifers that are willing to adopt and support every unwanted child for 18 years or more. 😂😂😂😂😂 Fat chance of that ever happening!!!!! I've got a better chance of winning the lottery 3 times before that will ever happen!!!!
ImperialAerosolKidFromEP · 51-55, M
I'm sure the slavery debate seemed even more hopeless than that, for a time
wildbill83 · 41-45, M
HikingMan · 56-60, M
In a society that values privacy and autonomy, in a land where men impregnate woman and then leave and often go on for years or forever without paying child support, In a country where the legal system pays little mind and under punishes rapists, and Judges have been quoted as saying things like "We shouldn't ruin his life for one mistake..." AT a time when it costs an average of $35,000 a year to raise a single child...
None of what is being proposed makes any sense at all.
And please, people..., don't come at me with your religion, because this is the land of religious freedom and your religion matters not as a matter of law or even true morality...
It's all bunk!
None of what is being proposed makes any sense at all.
And please, people..., don't come at me with your religion, because this is the land of religious freedom and your religion matters not as a matter of law or even true morality...
It's all bunk!
Atari2678 · 41-45, M
I feel that does not have to be the answer to it .