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How can Trump be anything else than guilty?

I'm having a hard time with this.

Any reasonable person can agree there was a plan to alter the normal electoral process. Plenty of evidence here.

Any reasonable person can agree that Trump was behind those plans, or at least a major participant. Why? Because all he had to do was admit defeat and none of this happens.

Some folks may say that the plans were justified because the election was fraudulent. If that is the case, then Trump & friends need to quit being cowards and plead NO CONTEST, then provide evidence their actions were justified.

I just can't figure out why folks are still defending him.

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NatureGuy77 · 56-60, M

So every Democrat in Congress that said 2016 election of Trump was illegitimate and voted to impeach him should also be charged and found guilty of election tampering?

windinhishair · 61-69, M

@NatureGuy77 Yes, if they took concrete steps like Trump did to overturn the election results. Otherwise, it isn't a crime. Trump's crime wasn't lying about the election. It was actually doing things to change the results and remain in office. That's what he is charged with.

trollslayer · 46-50, M

@NatureGuy77 are you saying what Trump did is not a crime, or that he was justified because others did it?

SomeMichGuy · M

@NatureGuy77 The votes to impeach were not tied to claiming the 2016 vote was illegitimate.

You can read both sets of articles of impeachment.

trollslayer · 46-50, M

@SomeMichGuy These folks are afraid to read the actual documentation

NatureGuy77 · 56-60, M

@windinhishair They attempted to remove him from office. Essentially overturn the election.

NatureGuy77 · 56-60, M

@SomeMichGuy He was impeached for “soliciting” foreign interference in an election. Mueller Report found not evidence of such activity by Trump or his campaign.

SomeMichGuy · M

@NatureGuy77 You need to read what you said, which is not true, and what *is* true.

Impeachment is a CONSTITUTIONAL way of removing people commiting "high crimes and misdemeanors" in (executive) office.

Trump et al.'s attempt to *actually* thwart the real vote was UNconstitutional.

That's the difference.

SomeMichGuy · M

@NatureGuy77 He was impeached for various acts.

His solicitation of Russia was on-camera and televised.

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NatureGuy77 · 56-60, M

@windinhishair What high crimes other than not having a liberal mindset? I’d suggest you don’t get your direction from MSNBC

windinhishair · 61-69, M

@NatureGuy77 Trump's first impeachment was for extorting Ukraine to conduct a fake "investigation" of Joe Biden, which is a crime. His second was for planning and helping an insurrection against the US government to prevent the peaceful transfer of power to the legally elected president, Joe Biden.

You should pay more attention to what is happening in the world around you. Ignorance is very ugly, even for Trump Cultists.

NatureGuy77 · 56-60, M

@windinhishair They impeached him long before Biden even announced he was running. I realize some people need the govt to make it in life, but the continued pursuit of Trump is to stifle a political opponent

SomeMichGuy · M

@NatureGuy77 You really don't follow things for yourself, do you?

windinhishair · 61-69, M

@NatureGuy77 Yes, the impeachments were to remove a criminal president from office during his term of office. Now that he has been dragged out of office kicking and screaming and pouting, some of his crimes have been investigated, and he is now being held accountable for them as a private citizen. Do try to keep up.

SomeMichGuy · M

@windinhishair👆👆👆

NatureGuy77 · 56-60, M

@SomeMichGuy I have a job which grabs most of my attention. Perhaps you have more time?

SomeMichGuy · M

@NatureGuy77 You have to be really tuned out--or tuned into very skewed outlets--to not know what's been going on for years

NatureGuy77 · 56-60, M

@SomeMichGuy They’ve been after the guy for 7 years, and he hasn’t been convicted yet despite all the expense, time and effort of Democrats

SomeMichGuy · M

@NatureGuy77 ...again, you really have been under a rock.

NatureGuy77 · 56-60, M

@SomeMichGuy No, indictments and charges don’t equate to convictions.

SomeMichGuy · M

@NatureGuy77 I never said that.

But it isn't Democrats doing all of this. lol

windinhishair · 61-69, M

@NatureGuy77 Trump's personal foundation, that he used as a personal piggy bank according to prosecutors, was dissolved by the State of New York, and Trump and his children prevented from serving on the board of other foundations. Trump was found liable for rape and defamation, and ordered to pay a $5 million fine. Other charges are pending since he continued to defame the plaintiff after the ruling. He also paid $25 million to the students he ripped off through his fraudulent Trump University. The current criminal charges take a while to investigate, but now he will be held accountable for those crimes too.

LeopoldBloom · M

@NatureGuy77 So the Clinton impeachment was also illegal?

Impeachment is in the Constitution, so it’s not election interference. But please feel free to write your Congressman and ask them to propose an amendment taking impeachment off the table.