Information to consider

Chicago is not the “Murder Capitol” of the country.

The Pew Research Center reported in November that when adjusting for population, Chicago has recorded fewer murders per capita than many other smaller U.S. cities. Chicago ranked 14th among cities with at least 100,000 people in 2017. FBI statistics released this fall found St. Louis had the highest murder rate in 2017 — 66.1 homicides per 100,000 people. The Pew report said Chicago did have the highest actual number of homicides in the past few years. In 2016, there were 762 homicides. Last year, homicides dropped to 650. As of Dec. 6, there were 534. Pointing to Chicago to suggest that gun laws don't work is not a new talking point — Trump claimed Chicago had "the toughest gun laws in the United States" in a 2016 presidential debate, which is when this myth gained traction. He was, of course, wrong.

Chicago does not have the “toughest gun laws in the country.”

There hasn’t been a ban on handguns in the city limits for more than a decade, despite Trump’s assertions. Illinois is considered to have fairly tight gun laws. The state requires gun owners to obtain licenses and face background checks. It also imposes waiting periods on purchases. But unlike New York and California, Illinois, among other things, does not ban assault weapons or large-capacity magazines and does not require a state license for firearms dealers or one to sell ammunition. Many guns used within Chicago are actually purchased in states with weaker gun laws.

In fact:

60% of firearms recovered in crimes came from states with less regulation over firearms. Indiana accounted for about 1 in 5 of these weapons, followed by Mississippi and Wisconsin. The report says these trends have been consistent over the past decade.
(https://apnews.com/article/donald-trump-us-news-violence-laws-in-state-wire-64e34cffb7db4dc7bf9bcda2ea201ea7
Pew Research Foundation
NPR)

Incidentally: The twenty cities in the United States with the highest murder rates (murders per 100,000 people) are:
1. St. Louis, MO (69.4)
2. Baltimore, MD (51.1)
3. New Orleans, LA (40.6)
4. Detroit, MI (39.7)
5. Cleveland, OH (33.7)
6. Las Vegas, NV (31.4)
7. Kansas City, MO (31.2)
8. Memphis, TN (27.1)
9. Newark, NJ (25.6)
10. Chicago, IL (24)
11. Cincinnati, OH (23.8)
12. Philadelphia, PA (20.2)
13. Milwaukee, WI (20.0)
14. Tulsa, OK (18.6)
15. Pittsburgh, PA (18.4)
16. Indianapolis, IN (17.7)
17. Louisville, KY (17.5)
18. Oakland, CA (17.1)
19. Washington D.C. (17.0)
20. Atlanta, GA (16.7)
(https://worldpopulationreview.com/us-city-rankings/)

And for an interesting read on the efficacy of firearm accessibility (conservatives, you won’t be happy), check out:
chrome-extension://efaidnbmnnnibpcajpcglclefindmkaj/https://www.jhsph.edu/sebin/u/c/myths.pdf

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Montanaman · M

There's not a city in Montana on that list, and we have the least restrictive gun laws in the country.
Billings Crime rate including guns has drastically risen this year. Why? Drugs.
President Biden said again today...

There’s simply no rational basis for it in terms of self-protection, hunting," Biden claimed on Monday while comparing the difference in damage caused between a 9mm round and a .22-caliber

What an idiot!

***From my cold dead hands!***

Ban Ar-15's . President Clinton did it.
Okay. But what about the hundreds of thousands already out there? Mandatory buy back? Never gonna happen.
Waiting period and background check? Okay.

I could go on and on. I'm not going to change your mind, but I agree, something has to be done.😞

Meanwhile, gas hits above $8 a gallon in California, Inflation is killing the families in America. And...we're edging closer to the brink of War with Russia, China and North Korea!

Thank you Mr. President!😳

windinhishair · 61-69, M

@Montanaman Montana has the 11th highest rate of gun deaths per capita of the 50 US states (CDC data for 2020), so there ARE consequences to your lax gun laws that result in more deaths from guns.

Giving up and throwing your hands up because there are already lots of guns out there isn't a solution. It is capitulation, and accepting the periodic deaths of schoolchildren because, well, I guess there was nothing we could do. Shrug.

We need to ban assault weapons again now. Will it have an immediate effect? Not likely, but it will over time.

Montanaman · M

@windinhishair But...what is defined as an assault weapon? Ar-15's and the like? Or Any rifle or handgun wi over a 6, 8, 10, or 15 round capacity? That's My Problem. . .
Give an inch, take a mile.

windinhishair · 61-69, M

@Montanaman We can get bogged down in semantics and miss the point. Weapons that are designed to kill large numbers of people quickly and efficiently should be banned. I really don't care about the platform. Large clips and magazines should be banned. A small handgun for personal protection, or a hunting rifle for hunting are not a problem. You don't need an assault rifle for hunting, unless you are hunting humans.

Montanaman · M

@windinhishair Thinking... "Red Dawn" scenarios...I know it's a movie, actually 2, but it's not impossible in today's world aggressive climate, CHINA. RUSSIA. NORTH KOREA. It really scares me. The main reason that is an improbability, is because so many Americans are well armed. Unlike Ukraine.

windinhishair · 61-69, M

@Montanaman Our fortress-like mentality is a negative aspect of our collective psyche. Being scared all the time is very unhealthy.

Montanaman · M

@windinhishair Not really scared per say, just concerned. I don't let fear run my life. 👍🤨🤗

windinhishair · 61-69, M

@Montanaman I wasn't really referring to you, more to our collective fear of being without weapons. Some people can't even leave their house without one. That does great damage to a person's psyche and health.

I've never owned a firearm, and never will. I have no need for one. And I'm not afraid to go where I need to and do what I need to do. Packing heat never crosses my mind.

Montanaman · M

@windinhishair I'm just the opposite, except carrying makes me feel at ease in this crazy world.

Mak03 · F

@windinhishair so 8 rounds in a standard rifle would be fine to you but 12 would be to many? 6 in a revolver is ok but 12 in a semi auto is to much where is the line drawn?

windinhishair · 61-69, M

@Mak03 You have to draw a line somewhere. You're going to have a problem wherever the line is. I would rather come down on the side of regulating too much than too little.

Graylight · 51-55, F

@Mak03 The line is right here and now. Until this issue if figured out and we can act like sane adults, the answer to your question would appear to be 0 rounds.

The FBI collects data on “active shooter incidents,” which it defines as “one or more individuals actively engaged in killing or attempting to kill people in a populated area.” Using the FBI’s definition, 38 people – excluding the shooters – died in such incidents in 2020.

The Gun Violence Archive, an online database of gun violence incidents in the U.S., defines mass shootings as incidents in which four or more people are shot, even if no one was killed (again excluding the shooters). Using this definition, 513 people died in these incidents in 2020.

But... Nearly eight-in-ten (79%) U.S. murders in 2020 – 19,384 out of 24,576 – involved a firearm. That marked the highest percentage since at least 1968, the earliest year for which the CDC has online records. A little over half (53%) of all suicides in 2020 – 24,292 out of 45,979 – involved a gun.

Guns kill. Regardless of color, shape, caliber, grips, sights, or capacity.

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2022/02/03/what-the-data-says-about-gun-deaths-in-the-u-s/

windinhishair · 61-69, M

@Graylight Guns kill, and more guns means more gun deaths, as increased rates of gun deaths in states with high gun ownership attest.

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windinhishair · 61-69, M

@LvChris That's true. We know that fear is a powerful force driving the actions of many people. Republicans have historically done a great job exploiting that fear for political gain. It clearly drives many people to own guns.