Law enforcement reaction time in times of crisis.

@Adogslife no one should be able to invade the capitol and being stopped for a minor violation shouldn’t result in a death.

@justanothername But rioting your home city is somehow ok?

And yes, a traffic stop should NEVER end in death. There’s this thing called compliance that seems to be a trigger. I know if I get pulled over the #1 thing is to STFU and do as asked. Might help.

@Adogslife You know how sometimes you forget a necklace in in a bag or pocket, and by the time you attend to it, it's a tangled twisted mess? That seems to be how you process posts.

Compliance to poor protocol and possibly illegal commands is not the responsibility of a free citizen in this society. Not for you, not for me, not for anyone else. "Simply complying" too often ends in rape, in molestation, in robbery, in violence and in unequal and unethical power struggles. From the crowd of "you can't force me to wear a mask in a privately owned business," it's rich that you expect all the "others" to simply fold upon command.

@Graylight I never mentioned “illegal commands”. That’s apparently you being triggered.

You have discernible rights if you’re pulled over, including driving the speed limit to a place you feel safe. You have the right to deny search assuming nothing is visible to the officer that would outweigh that right.

The overwhelming number of traffic stops are routine and mundane. How you leap to rape, molestation, robbery, violence, as a basic response is beyond me.

As for your generalizations about mask wearing, I wear a mask every day no matter where I am in public. It’s what I can do help stop the spread of Covid, respect others and protect myself.

Common courtesy goes a long way. That very same courtesy, when faced with a traffic stop, will go a long way as well.

@Adogslife You could not trigger me with dynamite. Ignorance never can.

We weren't discussing all traffic stops. We were discussing bad traffic stops by bad officers. And no one said routine stops end in bad things. What was said was blind compliance to bad commands too often end up in hurt and wrongdoing.

You're employing tired and failed argument tactics that serve as the bedrock to the kind of people who contort themselves to defend bad behavior, and that's unproductive, so this is where the discussion ends.

@Adogslife no, rioting is never ok but neither is the killing of an innocent man during a routine traffic stop, which I might add was the trigger point for the riots.

@Adogslife I’m guessing you are WHITE and don’t have to live with the fear of being assumed guilty solely due to the colour of your skin?
The victim has every right to ask why he was being stopped and asked to get out of the car.

@justanothername You’re completely correct. The officer, if the stop is justified, has every right to request you exit the vehicle. And, legally you must do so. The Supreme Court ruled “...it’s little more than an inconvenience...”. As the driver, you have every right to ask why you’re getting pulled over. The officer also has to answer. That’s the “justifiable” part.

Yes, I do realize I’m white and it does make a difference. It’s been awhile since my black friends explained DWB to me. I do understand. But, I’m always going to come back to the point - don’t do something wrong and you won’t have to deal with the police. And, if on the odd chance you do, it really is best to be calm and comply.

If you’re alive, you can file a complaint against the police. You can even sue the department/municipality. But, you can’t do it if you’re dead.

If you’re really worried, record it on a dash cam or your phone. They can’t confiscate it or ask you to turn it off.

@AdogslifeThe issue is not about being pulled over for a minor traffic infringement, that happens to lots of people every day with no consequences. For a majority of black and coloured Americas is a sad reality of life in that the attitude of cops is biased against them and that is the problem.

@justanothername do you personally feel there’s a reason for that bias?

@Adogslife how many white guys do you see on the news being pinned to the ground by a cop for 9 minutes while they struggle to breathe after being pulled over for a minor misdemeanor violation that should only have resulted in an inconsequential trip to the local police station.

@Adogslife there’s an obvious racial bias.

@justanothername None. White on white crime isn’t newsworthy unless it’s a shooting spree. Then the shooter is killed on the spot (typically) and the news cycle ends 2-3 days later... unless it’s a school shooting. Then it makes the news for the same amount of time as your example.

@Adogslife so by that account should an unarmed person end up dead from a routine traffic infringement?... I think not.

@justanothername [quote] @Adogslife there’s an obvious racial bias.[/quote]

I know that’s what you feel and it’s a reality in many circumstances. What I asked previously was what you felt the reason was.

Is it really a racial bias or potentially a criminal bias based on the population density where these events occur? Why is it “racial” if a cop pulls a black person over in a primarily black neighborhood? That’s not racial, that’s simple probability. And if he over exerts the use of force in the stop, is that by definition racial? No. The cop may just be a prick - not uncommon. Same thing happens in a white neighborhood, it’s just not news. If it happens in a white neighborhood to a black person, it’s news. It’s always about the race and not the criminal... and I want to be clear, the use of excessive force IS WRONG.

Do you personally feel that the police force in an area should “match” the population? Anotherwords, if you have all black cops serving in all black communities, will that end this type of racial argument in your mind? Will it end the frustrations that lead to an abuse of power? My guess is no. You just won’t be able to call it racism.

And, just so we’re clear, the “WHITE” argument doesn’t fly. If it’s a white criminal that got abused by the police, I’d tell him he deserved it. Hopefully the beating would make him not be such a fucking idiot in the future. And, if he died we wouldn’t be having the conversation. There’d just be one less problem on the street. You play, you pay. Maybe you even pay the one time when you weren’t guilty. That’s the thing about karma. You can be 100% sure there’d be no sympathy, no news, no riots - black cop or white.