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@kayle [quote] It's not over at all. There are many investigations ongoing. One by New York State looking into Trump's very shady business dealings. Another by the IRS, and a number of lawsuits pending.
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Yay! More wastes of time, energy, and 'my' money over a temper tantrum being thrown by spoiled children who didn't get the most ridiculous candidate in history elected for them!
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Yay! More wastes of time, energy, and 'my' money over a temper tantrum being thrown by spoiled children who didn't get the most ridiculous candidate in history elected for them!
Can't say that I love it, but I get why others do, and I'd probably be cheering for stuff like this with certain other folks, if I didn't step back and look at this.
We've had two years of relatively defensive politics, while Democrats like Schiff basically have been whining about Trump, with a brief flurry of more activity after they took the house, but it's been still pretty muted with Mueller out and the establishment Democrats not wanting things to turn too nasty when they can't do impeachment, are outgunned by the Senate and the White House, and IMO, are really not quite as well suited for vitriolic attacks as Republicans are (I know, there are exceptions like Waters, and younger ones like Tlaib and AOC, and the media has been pretty aggressive).
I think up till now, despite Trump's the best defense is a high risk offense temperament, Republicans have held back a lot as well, between lingering old school conservatives like McCain holding them back, concern over Trump's impetuosity and inexperience, and the fact that Mueller and Rosenstein, are in fact Republicans, and while they have attacked the witch Hunt, most of the real vitriolic stuff has still been coming from Conservative media (again, there are lots of exceptions). Even Trump himself has arguably been relatively passive at times while he tries to juggle being President, leading the Party and his flock and his own nature.
The Barr Summary may be a real game changer, starting with the battle over revealing and using the fruit of Mueller's investigation, but likely, IMO, even more so later as it gets closer to election time.
Republicans have already started, with this Schiff thing, rumors of attack ads against journalists who contradict their spin on the Summary, and a very short victory lap already morphing into a more aggressive stance. I suspect, while they may lose some battles over the Mueller reveal, they'll have the upper hand and will soon be playing a a more brutal, reckless and big play offense than ever before with Trump playing QB and calling more and more of the plays.
The Democrats, despite folks like Pelosi and some lingering motivation not to get down in the dirt, will sling the mud back, and they'll need to if they want to stay in a high scoring game with Trump and the Senate giving the other side home field advantage and a louder, if not necessarily louder fan base.
I think the Republican call for Schiff's resignation is likely the beginning of much nastier and combative days ahead, and whether a Special Counsel is appointed to investigate the FISA/Dossier, the FBI, the deep state, the Obama administration, and the Clinton Crime Family or not, I expect that someone in the Republican Senate will step up and keep a Congressional hand in attacking their opposition so as to counter balance whatever oversight the Democrats are doing in the House and provide a more public investigation and witch Hunt than a Special Counsel or even an AG could manage.
However much fun this skirmish with Schiff might be, I think it's the beginning of a very bloody war.
We've had two years of relatively defensive politics, while Democrats like Schiff basically have been whining about Trump, with a brief flurry of more activity after they took the house, but it's been still pretty muted with Mueller out and the establishment Democrats not wanting things to turn too nasty when they can't do impeachment, are outgunned by the Senate and the White House, and IMO, are really not quite as well suited for vitriolic attacks as Republicans are (I know, there are exceptions like Waters, and younger ones like Tlaib and AOC, and the media has been pretty aggressive).
I think up till now, despite Trump's the best defense is a high risk offense temperament, Republicans have held back a lot as well, between lingering old school conservatives like McCain holding them back, concern over Trump's impetuosity and inexperience, and the fact that Mueller and Rosenstein, are in fact Republicans, and while they have attacked the witch Hunt, most of the real vitriolic stuff has still been coming from Conservative media (again, there are lots of exceptions). Even Trump himself has arguably been relatively passive at times while he tries to juggle being President, leading the Party and his flock and his own nature.
The Barr Summary may be a real game changer, starting with the battle over revealing and using the fruit of Mueller's investigation, but likely, IMO, even more so later as it gets closer to election time.
Republicans have already started, with this Schiff thing, rumors of attack ads against journalists who contradict their spin on the Summary, and a very short victory lap already morphing into a more aggressive stance. I suspect, while they may lose some battles over the Mueller reveal, they'll have the upper hand and will soon be playing a a more brutal, reckless and big play offense than ever before with Trump playing QB and calling more and more of the plays.
The Democrats, despite folks like Pelosi and some lingering motivation not to get down in the dirt, will sling the mud back, and they'll need to if they want to stay in a high scoring game with Trump and the Senate giving the other side home field advantage and a louder, if not necessarily louder fan base.
I think the Republican call for Schiff's resignation is likely the beginning of much nastier and combative days ahead, and whether a Special Counsel is appointed to investigate the FISA/Dossier, the FBI, the deep state, the Obama administration, and the Clinton Crime Family or not, I expect that someone in the Republican Senate will step up and keep a Congressional hand in attacking their opposition so as to counter balance whatever oversight the Democrats are doing in the House and provide a more public investigation and witch Hunt than a Special Counsel or even an AG could manage.
However much fun this skirmish with Schiff might be, I think it's the beginning of a very bloody war.
@Budwick Hmm. I see your point, maybe I should have said its going to escalate a lot now, but up until this point, there's arguably been very little fighting by one side, at least if you call the Democrats a side, since they had no weapons.
On the other hand, you could look at Trumpism on one side, and see Deep State forces working against him and his attacks on everyone who doesn't bow the head and bend the knee as the other side, in which case, the Mueller investigation might look like action.
Btw, sorry about the length.
On the other hand, you could look at Trumpism on one side, and see Deep State forces working against him and his attacks on everyone who doesn't bow the head and bend the knee as the other side, in which case, the Mueller investigation might look like action.
Btw, sorry about the length.
@JoeyFoxx This us v them mentality has always been there in both parties, but as much as Obama may have exacerbated it, I really think its modern roots come from Gingrich, and, as someone just pointed out to me recently, by others like Buchanan in the 1990s when Clinton went a little right and stole away Reagan voters.
The Bushes dabbled with it, but Trump is the first President to really fully mix division, fear, resentment, xenophobia, nationalism, and populism successfully, and he's more or less declared a holy war for his followers against everyone who crosses him.
The Bushes dabbled with it, but Trump is the first President to really fully mix division, fear, resentment, xenophobia, nationalism, and populism successfully, and he's more or less declared a holy war for his followers against everyone who crosses him.
JoeyFoxx · 51-55, M
@MistyCee Gingrich was an ass, but at least he put his money where his mouth was. The "contract" at least delivered in principle. There was a bit of meat to it. Buchanan was a tool. I forgot about him.
I don't lump HW and W together. I've often viewed Bill Clinton and HW as opposite sides of the same coin. HW compromised with a Democrat congress in ways that were painful. He and Clinton together strung together 8 years of the most fiscally responsible government in the last 4 decades.
There is simply too much ignorance these days... and the government marches on and no one is really paying attention to what happens as Congress changes nothing.
I don't lump HW and W together. I've often viewed Bill Clinton and HW as opposite sides of the same coin. HW compromised with a Democrat congress in ways that were painful. He and Clinton together strung together 8 years of the most fiscally responsible government in the last 4 decades.
There is simply too much ignorance these days... and the government marches on and no one is really paying attention to what happens as Congress changes nothing.
4meAndyou · F
I have had this whole "polar bear eats Adam Schiff while he is stranded on an iceberg naked turning blue" fantasy for over two months, ever since he announced, "Investigations are Sexy!" I am thrilled that the Republicans had the balls to reprimand him publicly for spreading lies. I think he is JUST as guilty as McCabe, Strohk and Page.
LeopoldBloom · M
@akindheart Trump should just get them from Putin.
akindheart · 61-69, F
@softspokenman no Obama was a Muslim who did everything he could to undermine the US. Again, if that is the best you can do....
akindheart · 61-69, F
@LeopoldBloom get what from Putin?
HoraceGreenley · 56-60, M
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Heartlander · 80-89, M
I think it reflects the universal acknowledgement that Adam Schiff has already convicted President Trump and his focus now, as it has always been, is on bundling unrelated innuendos and fake news stories to support his verdict :)
The basic strategy of Democrats seems to be that if they could just strip Republicans of power they could then have their way with us non-Democrats. Since Democrats show no interest in muzzling Schiff it's reasonable to assume that they are still using him as their battering ram to break down the White House door and evict President Trump. Mueller didn't work out for them, so try something else.
The basic strategy of Democrats seems to be that if they could just strip Republicans of power they could then have their way with us non-Democrats. Since Democrats show no interest in muzzling Schiff it's reasonable to assume that they are still using him as their battering ram to break down the White House door and evict President Trump. Mueller didn't work out for them, so try something else.
akindheart · 61-69, F
@Heartlander why do you think Pelosi put him on the Intel committee? to keep this Russian thing going. They are a disgrace.
Heartlander · 80-89, M
akindheart · 61-69, F
@Heartlander you said it so well. That Nadler is one piece of work...but you know Elijah Cummings is buddies with Mark Meadows..
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softspokenman · M
The Constitution wasn't written to protect a POTUS from the people. It was written to protect against any Authoritarian, Dictator, POTUS, from the systematic destruction of the US Gov. from the people.
"From Watergate we learned what generations before us have known; Our Constitution works. And during Watergate years it was interpreted again that no one - Absolutely No One - is above the law."
Leon Jaworski, Second Special Prosecuter during Watergate
"From Watergate we learned what generations before us have known; Our Constitution works. And during Watergate years it was interpreted again that no one - Absolutely No One - is above the law."
Leon Jaworski, Second Special Prosecuter during Watergate
softspokenman · M
@MistyCee ?
softspokenman · M
@MistyCee I'm trying to recall from memory what I had written as a reply to another post and I haven't had my 2nd cup of coffee yet 😵 PM?
softspokenman · M
When did AG Barr submit the full report of the Mueller investigation to Congress ?
akindheart · 61-69, F
@softspokenman he hasn't. the last I read it is coming Mid April and will be redacted.
softspokenman · M
It seems to me (I am an independent) that the GOP doesn't want to see The Whole Truth And Nothing But The Truth and also for it not to be seen by the Citizen tax payers and voters, who pay them very well and with benefits that many Blue Collar workers will never see, that paid for the investigation for some reason. We don't work for them they work for us. At first I thought that it was a good idea not to name people who were not found guilty of anything but some how that has turned into giving the GOP the right to redact anything that they don't like.
@akindheart
@akindheart
LeopoldBloom · M
@akindheart Let's see the full report and supporting evidence first.
akindheart · 61-69, F
@LeopoldBloom oh brother. you just can't accept that he is exonerated right. believe me, if they had found anything, he would have been charged. pick another topic
LeopoldBloom · M
@akindheart The only reason you don't want to see the report is because you're terrified that Barr's summary missed a few things. If it really did exonerate the president, he'd be calling for its immediate release. Even Barr's summary says the president isn't cleared of obstruction of justice, even if there isn't enough evidence to stand up in court. That doesn't mean he's innocent, as much as you'd like to think so.