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DeWayfarer · 61-69, M
Yes.
Yet please consider a different point of view. Such as one given by ChatGPT.
Surface languages have evolved. They are progressive. Not lesser than the classical languages.
It's necessary to understand the context of both. For in modern English love is summerised in one word. While in greek there are still nine different versions of it.
The classical languages can be quite cumbersome.
Think of it this way as well. Aramaic had serious problems with tenses. Imagine saying anything without a past tense. Like the word "is" instead of "was".
The inefficiency yet detailedness of the classical languages, gave way to the expediency of the surface languages.
A short hand is more efficient even still. Yet can broaden the concepts of communication
Yet please consider a different point of view. Such as one given by ChatGPT.
.
GPT-4o mini
Perspective on Language Value
Classical Languages
Cultural and Historical Context: These languages provide a window into ancient philosophies, literatures, and sciences, offering foundational knowledge that informs many modern fields, including linguistics, law, and ethics.
Modern Languages (like English)
Practical Application: Languages like English excel in their adaptability and are tailored for effective communication in today's scientific and technological landscapes. This makes them essential for current research and collaboration.
Balance of Perspectives
Both classical and modern languages have their strengths depending on the context. Classical languages are invaluable for historical knowledge, while modern languages are often more applicable in the fast-paced contemporary world.
GPT-4o mini
Perspective on Language Value
Classical Languages
Cultural and Historical Context: These languages provide a window into ancient philosophies, literatures, and sciences, offering foundational knowledge that informs many modern fields, including linguistics, law, and ethics.
Modern Languages (like English)
Practical Application: Languages like English excel in their adaptability and are tailored for effective communication in today's scientific and technological landscapes. This makes them essential for current research and collaboration.
Balance of Perspectives
Both classical and modern languages have their strengths depending on the context. Classical languages are invaluable for historical knowledge, while modern languages are often more applicable in the fast-paced contemporary world.
Surface languages have evolved. They are progressive. Not lesser than the classical languages.
It's necessary to understand the context of both. For in modern English love is summerised in one word. While in greek there are still nine different versions of it.
The classical languages can be quite cumbersome.
Think of it this way as well. Aramaic had serious problems with tenses. Imagine saying anything without a past tense. Like the word "is" instead of "was".
The inefficiency yet detailedness of the classical languages, gave way to the expediency of the surface languages.
A short hand is more efficient even still. Yet can broaden the concepts of communication
ArishMell · 70-79, M
@DeWayfarer
We know the Classical languages only by what survives in written form by their contemporary academics and literati, not by any colloquial and dialect forms they may have had when living, day-to-day languages. Both though are reflected in modern Western European languages, and used extensively in scientific and legal terms.
re Aramaic's lack of tenses. It has become a strange fashion for modern historians and novellists to ignore the past tense, and to speak or write in a blandly passive present tense that ruins the narrative. As:-
"The King is travelling to London..."
Still? You have already told us,
"he is born in October 1452 and die[i]s in August 1485".*[/i]
And:-
"Alone in the house, Philomena pours herself a mug of coffee, picks up her 'phone and taps Tarquin's number..."
Beyond that cliched style anyway ("Alone at home, Philomena rang Tarquin" would be neater and tighter), is the next chapter contemporaneous with that? For it tells us,
"Philomena wraps her arms around him. 'I love you, Tarquin!' she breathes." ?
====
*Yes, traffic around the capital can be a nightmare, and travelling was slower still in King Richard III's era; but....
We know the Classical languages only by what survives in written form by their contemporary academics and literati, not by any colloquial and dialect forms they may have had when living, day-to-day languages. Both though are reflected in modern Western European languages, and used extensively in scientific and legal terms.
re Aramaic's lack of tenses. It has become a strange fashion for modern historians and novellists to ignore the past tense, and to speak or write in a blandly passive present tense that ruins the narrative. As:-
"The King is travelling to London..."
Still? You have already told us,
"he is born in October 1452 and die[i]s in August 1485".*[/i]
And:-
"Alone in the house, Philomena pours herself a mug of coffee, picks up her 'phone and taps Tarquin's number..."
Beyond that cliched style anyway ("Alone at home, Philomena rang Tarquin" would be neater and tighter), is the next chapter contemporaneous with that? For it tells us,
"Philomena wraps her arms around him. 'I love you, Tarquin!' she breathes." ?
====
*Yes, traffic around the capital can be a nightmare, and travelling was slower still in King Richard III's era; but....
DeWayfarer · 61-69, M
@ArishMell please read below. Yet Hebrew is technically a modern day classical language.
I'm only quoting ChatGPT on that though. 🤷🏻♂
It as well includes Arabic however.
As to Aramaic. The typical KJV of the Bible in Genesis highlights the tense issue with the italicization of the word "was".
They are still arguing over what exactly "is" the meaning of those words.
I'm only quoting ChatGPT on that though. 🤷🏻♂
It as well includes Arabic however.
As to Aramaic. The typical KJV of the Bible in Genesis highlights the tense issue with the italicization of the word "was".
They are still arguing over what exactly "is" the meaning of those words.
AnonyThinker · 26-30
@DeWayfarer for example take Electricity
In ancient greek Amber was called elektron. It has the property to attract small pieces of papers when rubbed with cloth. So this quality of elektron became electricity a thing that attracts so when you hear electricity you have picture in you mind, its not that your mind collect information but your existence become aware of the knowledge.
In ancient greek Amber was called elektron. It has the property to attract small pieces of papers when rubbed with cloth. So this quality of elektron became electricity a thing that attracts so when you hear electricity you have picture in you mind, its not that your mind collect information but your existence become aware of the knowledge.
ArishMell · 70-79, M
@DeWayfarer Oh, I agree with that. Hebrew, or its modern form, is still a living language.
So is Greek, although my holiday phrase-book warns that if you try speaking Greek as learnt from the Classics at school, you would sound very stilted and old-fashioned to the Greeks themselves.I am not sure if the English public-schools (by British definition) lean so heavily on Greek and Latin now though. These two languages, particularly Latin, had been entry-requirements for the older universities, irrespective of your intended course. Latin has been revived by some schools as an option, and apparently is quite popular!
The difficulty with the oldest languages I suppose, is trying to assimilate modern, especially technical, words coined in English - or more likely, American.
It is probably easier for those languages like Greek and Hebrew that have evolved over the millennia; but harder when trying to revive a language that had dwindled to being spoken by only a relatively small proprtion of the population, such as Gaelic (always mainly Northern Scotland) and Welsh (which had retreated mainly to NW Wales.)*
While English itself is a right mongrel of old forms of Scandian, Germanic, French, Latin and Greek, with a later sprinkling of Asian and now American.
.....
* Google Translate tells me "microwave oven" is popty microdon in Welsh.
I already knew that the adjective follows the noun, as shown, and that popityping is merely an old joke or perhaps slang.
So is Greek, although my holiday phrase-book warns that if you try speaking Greek as learnt from the Classics at school, you would sound very stilted and old-fashioned to the Greeks themselves.I am not sure if the English public-schools (by British definition) lean so heavily on Greek and Latin now though. These two languages, particularly Latin, had been entry-requirements for the older universities, irrespective of your intended course. Latin has been revived by some schools as an option, and apparently is quite popular!
The difficulty with the oldest languages I suppose, is trying to assimilate modern, especially technical, words coined in English - or more likely, American.
It is probably easier for those languages like Greek and Hebrew that have evolved over the millennia; but harder when trying to revive a language that had dwindled to being spoken by only a relatively small proprtion of the population, such as Gaelic (always mainly Northern Scotland) and Welsh (which had retreated mainly to NW Wales.)*
While English itself is a right mongrel of old forms of Scandian, Germanic, French, Latin and Greek, with a later sprinkling of Asian and now American.
.....
* Google Translate tells me "microwave oven" is popty microdon in Welsh.
I already knew that the adjective follows the noun, as shown, and that popityping is merely an old joke or perhaps slang.
DeWayfarer · 61-69, M
@AnonyThinker I don't believe any one of us on your post would deny English is a "surface language". Just there is debate over what a "classical language" is.
Your own statement about Arabic being a classical language" is one that is debatable. Though ChatGPT does include Arabic after some reminders. Please remember it left out Hebrew as well though. 😆
One could suppose it was attempting to be unbiased by the omission of both.
Your own statement about Arabic being a classical language" is one that is debatable. Though ChatGPT does include Arabic after some reminders. Please remember it left out Hebrew as well though. 😆
One could suppose it was attempting to be unbiased by the omission of both.