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What is a truly great man?

The ambitions of Napoleon, Hitler, Stalin and Mao were built of the sacrifice of millions of people. And with pitifully little to show in the aftermath. The ambition of Charles de Gaulle, however, was just to rescue his homeland France from its shattering moral and military collapse in 1940 to its present restored eminence by the time of his voluntary retirement in 1969.

The steady decline of France from Napoleonic glory to the decadent surrender of Petain and Vichy stimulated De Gaulle, a minor officer and voice out large at the time, to take refuge in London and, with just a few supporters, to emerge in 1944 as the undisputed personification of France. How did he do it? This is then the subject of the new movie on him with the title The Battle of de Gaulle of which the first part is released in June.

Julian Jackson's book "A Certain Idea of France: The Life of Charles de Gaulle" beforehand written, gives a terrific portrait of De Gaulle's bloody-minded, intransigent and at times self-defeating promotion of France as a great nation is fascinating and very well written. He towered like the vast granite dolmen that he physically resembled over his contemporaries and, by the end, succeeded in establishing the 5th Republic (which endures), freeing Algeria and rebutting communism.

The recent French movie that was directed by Antonin Baudry and divided into two chapters, respectively subtitled "The Iron Age" and "I Write Your Name", is an adaptation of parts of Jackson's book. It revisits De Gaulle's life between May 1940 (Battle of Montcornet) and 1944 (Liberation of Paris), the first chapter focusing on the period 1940-1942 and the second on the years 1943-1944. In short, it's a sweeping two-part historical saga and geopolitical thriller that plunges the audience into the decisive hours of World War II through the eyes of General Charles de Gaulle and the men and women who refused to surrender when the French nation collapsed.

June 1940. France collapses and signs the armistice. In the midst of the chaos, one man refuses to give up. Alone against all odds, this unknown general flees to London to save what remains of freedom. Without an army, without support, without hope. But with an irrational conviction: France, his France, has not laid down its arms. Taking the ultimate gamble, he seeks to convince the world that the battle for France is neither over nor lost. Reality, however, is unshakeable and seems determined to prove him wrong. Yet, little by little, resistance fighters, rebellious students, and determined soldiers rise up in England, France, and Africa to join the cause.

In only six weeks time in the early summer of 1940, France was over-run by German troops and quickly surrendered. The French government of Marshal Pétain sued for peace and signed an armistice. One little-known junior French general though, the most junior general in the French Army at the time, refuses to accept defeat and makes his way to England. On 18 June he spoke to his compatriots over the BBC, urging them to rally to him in London. 'Whatever happens, the flame of French resistance must not be extinguished and will not be extinguished.' At that moment, Charles de Gaulle entered into history.

For the rest of the war, De Gaulle frequently bit the hand that fed him. He insisted on being treated as the true embodiment of France, and quarrelled violently with Churchill and Roosevelt. He was prickly, stubborn, aloof and self-contained. But through sheer force of personality and bloody-mindedness he managed to have France recognised as one of the victorious Allies, occupying its own zone in defeated Germany. For ten years after 1958 he was President of France's Fifth Republic, which he created and which endures to this day

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Thinkerbell · 41-45, F
Churchill had an apt comment about De Gaulle:

"The hardest cross I had to bear in WW2 was the Cross of Lorraine."
Munumbis · 46-50, M
The greatest men are men of science. Like the legend of Merlin they alter the very nature of the world it's self. They change the very nature of man making him immune to terrible plagues and feeding him where he would have starved. Such men hold the power of the sun it's self in their hands. The codebook of life opens at their command. Few even know their names. The masses do not realize that often they live only because of them.
val70 · 56-60
@Munumbis The existance of God points to the fact that anything written down since the 19th century doesn't mean anything different than the writings from ages ago pondering on the same subject matter. If human beings would have created God for their own use, well, they won't have bothered with writing anything till Darwin wrote his theory down. Somehow thinking didn't start with Darwin. That I do know for certain
Munumbis · 46-50, M
@val70 I'm an atheist I don't have a religious code that I live by.
val70 · 56-60
@Munumbis Welcome to this group for French people then (still roughly 45%–55% of the population is Christian) :)
Picklebobble2 · 61-69, M
@val70 That truly is sad.

Jean Moulin
Jean Danjou
Even Napoleon Bonaparte might be said to better represent the ideal hero
val70 · 56-60
@Picklebobble2 Is how la dame tournes :) La France!
Thatsright · 61-69, M
US General Jacob Devers, 6th Army Group Commander had a large force of Free French, in mostly US Army uniforms with Free French insignia and accruements. The Free French Army also had all American made weapons and vehicles. The equipment they had from the forces in Africa was mostly derelict. General Devers had to deal with his subordinate of the First Free French Army, whose name escapes me, and General De Gaul. General De Gaul was a general without portfolio. And he bickered with General Eisenhower and the General placed in command of the Free French Army. General Eisenhower gladly placed the Free French Army under General Devers’ command. Devers did not speak French fluently, but was able to communicate with the help of a former US Senator who resigned and joined the Army. General Devers was not in good graces with General Eisenhower. He had to scrounge his own interpreters, who were really fluent had some knowledge of politics. Lt Col Henry Cabot Lodge, a former US Senator was in a combat unit and was schooled in France. General Devers deportment and respect towards the Free French Army and Lodge’s political acumen made the thing work. General Devers’ is the most influential though underrated military leader in US history.

The 6th Army Group was key element of the Allied Expeditionary Force. Formed as a step child to appease General Marshal and an attempt to get Devers separated from Ike.

I told you ALL that to tell you this. De Gaul was a royal pain in everyone’s ass until he died. He was all show, no go. But a great cheerleader who did give the French people hope. Devers and Lodge kept the peace.
val70 · 56-60
@Thatsright I'm sure that your family members were living in Lille opposite De Gaulle's too :)
Thatsright · 61-69, M
@val70 Nope. All here or in territories. Some of the young men were in the Pacific, Atlantic, Africa or Europe, but not living there. They all came back. Damaged in some way. All are gone now. The allies conquered the world and gave it back, helped rebuild. Made the two of the Axis countries economic power houses. And Italy a cool place to visit.
val70 · 56-60
@Thatsright I was kidding. Mine were. A distant uncle of mine was telling his stories over and over again. De Gaulles had a strict upbringing in Lille. His father was a school teacher, I seem to remember
Picklebobble2 · 61-69, M
Hard to see DeGaulle as anything other than man with privilege who chose to use it by hiding away in a foreign place as his countrymen endured horrors he never saw or imagined until his 'triumphant return' AFTER the occupying Nazi's had left.
val70 · 56-60
@Picklebobble2 I'm troubled by the lack of history there. De Gaulle was president from 1958 till 1969
Picklebobble2 · 61-69, M
@val70 No. You just choose to flag wave for a hero who wasn't
val70 · 56-60
@Picklebobble2 Well, a 2005 poll conducted by the public broadcaster France 2 over here, titled "Le Plus Grand Français de Tous les Temps" (The Greatest Frenchman of All Time), ranked him highly for his leadership during World War II and for founding the Fifth Republic. First actually :)
Thatsright · 61-69, M
This isn’t paywalled. It looks like it though.

https://www.ydr.com/story/opinion/columnists/2015/10/27/jacob-l-devers-ww-ii-why-didnt-ike-like-him/74617132/
val70 · 56-60
@Thatsright This isn't about the US nor general Devers. It's about France (see group) and De Gaule (new movie out in June)
Thatsright · 61-69, M
@val70 Yeah. That’s what I read. And my reading in the past on the general led me to Henry Cabot Lodge and Devers. Sorry. Now, I’ll go sit somewhere and read. Historical fiction today. On the beach.
val70 · 56-60
@Thatsright You're much right about Devers though. I once was in really nasty discussion about Patton with a local historian that wrote a book him. I reviewed that book of hers on the blog of the library that I work for. She came back at me hostile. I only said that she didn't mention the comments about the concentration camp victims that he made. I know for a fact that Marshal wanted him send home right then. Ike protected him because he was good as a battlefield general

 
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