I Am Christian

@hippyjoe1955

I think it's necessarily a thoughtful position because you only arrive at it by finding the evidence for a deity unconvincing.
You can't be an atheist if you just thoughtlessly accept the faith based claims of theism.

@MetalGreymon You have never thought about the emptiness and thoughtlessness of atheism. If we are simply the result of materialism then we are nothing but random atoms bumping into each other which means any thoughts we might have are utterly meaningless. Simply random atoms in random movements. No meaning or significance what so ever.

@hippyjoe1955

[quote]. No meaning or significance what so ever.[/quote]

....and?
What does that have to do with atheism being a thoughtless position?
How does the absence of objective meaning make arriving at the conclusion that there is no compelling evidence for god thoughtless?

@MetalGreymon If there is no meaning there is no meaning. Maybe your lack of philosophical understanding is keeping you from grasping that. Material does not beget thought or reason. Material doesn't beget anything. It is lifeless.

@hippyjoe1955

[quote] If there is no meaning there is no meaning[/quote]

Yeah...i'm not disputing that. I'm just wondering why you think that has anything to do with atheism being a thoughtless position.

[quote]Material does not beget thought or reason[/quote]

Maybe. Maybe not🙂

@MetalGreymon Atheism precludes thought. If there is nothing higher than the material we are made from then there is no higher thought. It is quite simple that way. What we think is simply random atoms randomly bumping into each other. Some atoms form water and others formulate the theory of relativity. Neither are of importance or significance since they are simply random atoms doing random atom things.

@hippyjoe1955

[quote]Neither are of importance or significance since they are simply random atoms doing random atom things.[/quote]

Yup. I agree.
So how does the lack of significance mean that atheism is a thoughtless position?

@MetalGreymon Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha You don't get it do you? Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha GASP!!!!!!! If there is no thought anything you think is [b][i][u]irrelevant!!!!![/u][/i][/b]

@hippyjoe1955

[quote][quote] If there is no thought anything you think is irrelevant!!!!![/quote][/quote]

Yeah...but you're the one who's claiming there is no thought, not me.
And you've yet to give me a reason to think you're correct.

@MetalGreymon You are the one saying there is significance in random atom interaction not me.

@hippyjoe1955

[quote]You are the one saying there is significance in random atom interaction[/quote]

Uhhh...actually i've been consistently agreeing with you that there is no inherent significance.
You've just been failing to demonstrate how that lack of significance means that atheism is a thoughtless position.

@MetalGreymon You are a bit thick then aren't you. If you cut the branch off you are sitting on you are no longer sitting on a branch. If there is no significant thought then atheism can not be significant thought.

@hippyjoe1955

What's with this introduction of [i]significant[/i] thought? What does that mean?
Are we changing the goal posts now?

Let's back up.

You said that there is no thought needed or allowed in atheism. A statement which i took to mean that atheism is a thoughtless position.
This is of course objectively incorrect.

So how did we get from there to " if there's no significance, then atheists can't think" ?

@MetalGreymon Obviously not. lol lol lol!!!!!

@hippyjoe1955

Well ok. I guess that concludes the portion of the interaction where we intelligently try to communicate our positions.
That's your decision i suppose.
But next time you want to make a flippant statement about atheism, be prepared to back it up😉

@MetalGreymon There can be no intelligent conversation since there can be no rational thought if all we are is random atoms doing random atom things like bumping into each other. Only an atheist would deny this simple fact.

@hippyjoe1955

[quote] there can be no rational thought if all we are is random atoms doing random atom things[/quote]

Sorry, i reject your premise.
Can you give me a reason why i should accept it?

@MetalGreymon Your thoughts are unimportant and useless. They are simply the product of random atoms doing random things. Therefore who cares what you think. Or what premise you reject. You are simply random atoms. No more signifciant than the snow flake that melted last March. Have a nice existence until you become non existent - oh wait can something that has no significance even have a non existence? No point in asking an atheist they deny existence.

@hippyjoe1955

[quote] They are simply the product of random atoms doing random things[/quote]

Well i can't disagree with that.
Although you didn't frame it in a way that particularly invites discussion lol

[quote] No point in asking an atheist they deny existence.[/quote]

Ah, there's another one of those flippant comments that i advised you to be able to back up lol

What makes you think atheists deny existence?

@MetalGreymon If all you are is random atoms then your random atoms have nothing to say to my random atoms that holds any significance. We are simply random atoms doing random things.

@hippyjoe1955

Oh i see. This is a fundamental misunderstanding about what is random.
I'm sorry. My fault for not clarifying.
Order may arise from the pressure of natural forces. Order certainly arises from our minds. I think you're conflating purposelessness with randomness.

@MetalGreymon No random remains random without a cause and you have completely eliminated the cause. Therefore random remains random and any thoughts you might have are the product of random interaction of random atoms. Of course one could logically argue that atoms can not exist without Causation but you don't want to accept that. Not that it makes any difference since you are no more than random atoms doing random atom things.

@hippyjoe1955

[quote] you have completely eliminated the cause[/quote]

Well no, joe. You know that's wrong.
What i've done is eliminate god as the cause. You appear to feel that means there can be no coherence.
I reject your premise.
🙂

@MetalGreymon Without a cause there is no being.

In the beginning was nothing
And nothing happened to nothing unti -
Suddenly with out reason or cause nothing exploded and became everything
Some time later some bits of everything (again for no reason or cause whatsoever) got together and formed dinosaurs.

You really don't have a clue son. Atheism is deficient on its face and only gets worse the longer you study it.

@hippyjoe1955

Why should i, an atheist suppose that nothing existed? How can we make the assumption that nothing necessarily precedes existence?
Do you have any evidence to that effect? Has anyone ever observed nothing?

Sorry, i reject your premise🙂