[quote]To be deep in history is to cease to be Protestant.[/quote]
noted St. John Henry Newman once upon a time - himself brought up as an Anglican before 'crossing the Tiber' to Rome.
He didn't mean that all Protestants aware of history must by some rule become Catholic, but more an observation that the Church is intimately bound up in historical reality (and, from the point of view of conversions, that Christian history fundamentally argues against protestantism, and many protestants who study history, including himself, may in time come to realise that the Catholic Church is the 'true' Church - the Church which Christ himself founded and entrusted to St. Peter.
[quote]Thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. [i]Matt. 16:18[/i][/quote]
One of Jesus's under-appreciated aspects, incidentally, is his fondness for puns and sarcastic jokes: both Πέτρος in Greek, or כֵּיפָא [Kepha{s}] in Aramaic, means ‘rock’: St. Peter’s original name was Simon. (Witness also the Lord's famous comment about rich men and eyes of needles).
Anyway - [i]extra Ecclesiam nulla salus[/i] - outside the Church there is no salvation. This is because in a very real sense, the Church IS salvation.
As Catholics, we are, in the words of St John Paul II, "part of a building, that has the Apostles and Prophets for its foundations, and Christ Jesus himself for its cornerstone."
[quote]I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. [i]Matt. 28:20[/i][/quote]
The Church [i]is[/i], according to the providential plan of God. Centuries and millennia have passed, but Holy Church continues to be [i]the[/i] Church of the risen Christ.
As Catholics some of us might disagree from time to time, from huge matters (the implications of the Second Vatican Council), to small ones (is the wine cruet of the right size?), but there is an essential and fundamental unity in Catholicism alone, a unity in Christ, in the men and their successors he himself chose to feed his sheep, until he comes again.
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@helenS Inevitably this is a question where people disagree (including Catholics among themselves!).
But the short answer is 'no', and has always been 'no'.
The pithy phrase is probably better expressed as 'outside the Church there is no [i]guaranteed means[/i] of salvation.' The catechism states that "all salvation comes from Christ the Head through the Church which is his Body", but this is not intended to damn everyone who doesn't know Christ and the Church:
In various ways and in various means people can be ignorant of the Gospel, and/or of the Church. We also know that God is abundantly merciful, and fair, and those who have what is known as 'invincible ignorance' can of course be saved as well. Damnation is, I suppose, turning away from God (as often gets said: God sends no one to hell: we send ourselves) - and a person who does not know God, or has never had a full opportunity to know God, or to embrace the faith, cannot be judged on not having the faith!
A good example of this is the Greek philosopher Aristotle, who in the mediaeval era was very often called the 'Apostle to the Pagans', because while he, living centuries before Christ, could not possibly be a Christian, he expressed ideas and principles which in his own pagan context are (mostly) entirely compatible with what the Church teaches of salvation. Perhaps in some way people like Aristotle prepared some groups of people for a message that would come later. The implication of being called an 'apostle' is that Aristotle merits heaven.
In some ways it's related to how the Church views the subject of heresy: there is 'formal' heresy, which is deliberately rejecting what the Church teaches despite understanding it (this might be someone like John Calvin), and there is 'material' heresy, where one believes something the Church teaches is heretical, but one doesn't necessarily know that it is heresy, for instance because it is what one was taught growing up (such as a Calvinist protestant today in the 21st century). A material heretic has never really rejected the Church, and thus must be judged by a different metric from one who has.
This is basically an essay length answer now lol - but the idea behind the phrase is that the Church, capital-C, teaches the true faith and the guaranteed means of salvation, but that others (other Christians and non-Christians alike) can teach some or almost all of that faith and those means.
An Anglican (part of a wider small-c Christian church), a Muslim, a Buddhist, an atheist even, could in theory be saved too. But since that is not guaranteed, bringing people into the Church, big-C, is important.
@helenS That is the church trying to exert its power over the masses. No where in the Bible or early church teachings does it say you must go to church to be saved. Jesus said you must be born again. The apostles said you must believe and be baptized (in that order). Paul said we are saved by Grace and not by works so..... The church likes to make all kinds of false claims about itself. Today's roman catholic church is being led by a man who is not a catholic or a Christian. He is a marxist.
@hippyjoe1955 On the contrary Acts shows that the Apostles and other early Christians continued regular communal prayer, and attended at the Temple in Jerusalem (and synagogues elsewhere, presumably). We tend to assume that they led, and should lead, by example. If they went 'to church' or met as 'a church', believing it important for salvation and for the worship of God, so must we.
Moreover we are called by Scripture (presumably any reference to sacred tradition would fall on deaf ears!) to put our faith into practice. If we truly believe in God, his very existence demands worship. We can worship God alone, but how much more fitting to unite as a community to do this?
Of course we must go to church!
St Ignatius wrote to the Magnesians, round about the year 100:
[quote]As therefore the Lord did nothing without the Father, being united to Him, neither by Himself nor by the apostles, so [b]neither do anything without the bishop and presbyters[/b]. Neither endeavour that anything appear reasonable and proper to yourselves apart; but [b]being come together into the same place, let there be one prayer, one supplication, one mind, one hope, in love and in joy undefiled[/b]. There is one Jesus Christ, than whom nothing is more excellent. Therefore [b]run together as into one temple of God, as to one altar, as to one Jesus Christ[/b], who came forth from one Father, and is with and has gone to one.[/quote]
We might debate where the emphasis, on 'going to church' as a physical place, and 'meeting as a church' of fellow Christians, might be placed, but one is absolutely called by the Church Fathers from the earliest times to meet together (and after of course the end of the persecutions, Christians could set aside public buildings for this).
@Persephonee Gathering for prayer and communion is part of the Christian faith but it does not mandate any one institution as arbiter of said practice. One does not need the blessing of a bishop to conduct communion since that is something that Jesus Himself instituted. There are requirements and qualifications but being mandated by a catholic bishop is not one of them. Likewise baptism. Proclaiming the Gospel (which the catholic church doesn't do) Baptism and communion are the only things the church is mandated to do.
@Persephonee Thank you for your informed and thought-out answer to my question. In my opinion, "church" means "totality of all Christians". That's why the church is the [u]body[/u] of Christ. Salvation is not restricted to a subset of this body. Thank you again 🌸
