Where love rules, there is no will to power, and where power predominates, love is lacking. The one is the shadow of the other.
Is that true? If so, how does God manage to combine both? Is it a case of defining the word "power" differently? Or of divorcing "power" from the "will" perhaps?
Then we have from the NT:- "My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness.”
All things to muse upon and think about.
Jung again:-
All the greatest and most important problems are fundamentally unsolvable. They can never be solved, but only outgrown.
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Definitely a case of defining the word power - God is all powerful means he is greater and capable _ there is nothing he is not able to achieve.
God does not have control over people, nor does he want to - or have an influence in the means of their beliefs and possible way of living a righteous life over an estimated 1/4 of the population. God is not forcing anyone to do anything - he lets every individual decide their own path, to make their own choices on a minute by minutes, second by second basis...... If he was using power to control people the whole Earth would be at peace, living with love and harmony and everyone would believe in him, no different religions, no atheism, no agnostics.
And actually he's not threatening anyone to do anything _ he's warning one of the consequences of one's actions. Yet to unbelievers is taken as a threat....... A stop sign or a red light is a warning if you cross without stopping and obeying the rules that are applied, the outcome has a 99% chance of being devastating.
@Emosaur scripture tells us hell was created for the devil and his angels. So yes indeed God created hell to send the rebellious ones there.
Your analogy that my argument is only consistent if one considers people free and they're held at gunpoint?????
Being held at gunpoint you're being forced to do something against your will. God isn't forcing you or anyone else to do anything - you're free to do as you choose. Man's laws on this Earth is the only thing that puts limits on what you can and shouldn't do and then it's only if you get caught doing it where you have to suffer the consequences....... God is saying do what you want - this is what you will or won't get - the choice is yours. .
@Emosaur you know exactly how it works - if you choose not to go to hell then you'll choose the righteous way of living - the choices you make here determines the judgment rendered on you. Like your comment about a person being held at gunpoint - well the person holding the gun will go to jail as a result of their CHOICE of actions - even by man's standards judgment is rendered. Your comment is lacking in the intended sarcasm!
😆🤣😆 now you know that is not what I mean..... What you are saying is like standing before a judge in a court of law, being sentenced to life imprisonment and you telling the judge you choose not to go to prison and trying to walk away.
I know you have the sense of understanding and possibly trying to be humorous, if not sarcastic.
@Emosaur Free will applies in choosing to do right or wrong.
Free will apply a person taking and enslaving another - brutalizing them, raping them, killing them - the person who does these wrongs has the free will to choose to do so.
There is a difference in opposing one's free will upon another .... There is a difference between forcing someone to do or not to do. Anyone with common sense would know this.
God does not force anyone to do wrong _ God does not force anyone to do right _ God gives everyone the right to choose their own way.
Did you actually say "who am I to tell you not to choose to go to hell" something is wrong with you you need to read what I said again with understanding the words as I wrote them.
I personally don't care what you choose as I said it's not my concern.
@Emosaur where are you coming from with this magically change reality and history you are getting a little too weird.
And if you held a gun on me and tried to make me do something and I refuse to do it that means I choose for you to shoot me before I do what you say. And if you shoot that means you "chose" to shoot and guess who's wrong you are. Just like the slaves who chose to dive off the ship into the water to drown than to be subjected to slavery - they chose. Are the slaves who chose to run away and risk death and /or mutilation - they chose.
@Emosaur sin is an individual choice not something that is imposed upon others that is why we even have laws of the land because men are sinful by nature.
The strange thing is Jesus said the whole world will see him coming back from the clouds in the sky with his angels. There are a lot of things going on up there in the sky that the US government even is beginning to release and talk about. Extraterrestrial activities meaning not from this world - guess what God his angels are not from this world.
Evolution is a analysis made by men as to what their analysis say occurred. Now if you believe in the theory of panspermia _ that living organisms came From outer Space and begin the process of evolution on Earth and don't believe The Entity we refer to as God exist in outer space what does that say about you?
Or
If you believe in the theory of abiogenesis _ that life sprung up spontaneously and begin to evolve, for a long time they didn't even know where RNA came from and they're still debating on it depending on what theory is in use and to give up you don't believe that the entity we call God could have sprung up spontaneously somewhere in this void endless space - what does that say about you?
It says you are just negative against the idea of a creator cuz either scientific hypotheses is farfetched.
Free Will does not change or make evolution of fact or not -- WOW
sin is an individual choice not something that is imposed upon others
sin is very much imposed on others because it only exists as a conecpt in certain religions and their morality. People like to use the concept of sin to put murder and gay love on the same level which is insane.
Also even if we would all share this belief of sin we all are subject to our environments and other social, biological and natural factors so individual choice is often out of the picture because many situations are just coercive.
Also saying it's a choice only then to follow up saying people are sinful by nature is a contradiction
@Emosaur you most likely misunderstood what the Christian was saying we deserve to be punished because Adam and Eve "messed" up. Never heard a Christian in all my years make that statement. Everybody pays for their "own" sins.
You believe what you want to believe about Evolution it is an analysis made by man _ who other than man analyzed it? Or do you know the definition of the word analyze/analysis.
Don't believe in panspermia that's a choice! *Your choice* https://www.popularmechanics.com/space/a43369141/new-evidence-suggests-earth-life-came-from-space/
DNA came from RNA and until they agree totally 100%, there will always be more than one theory on how life started on this planet.
https://youtu.be/LrZXGtX7gtk
You use the word again Why? But I'll use it and have good reason to because I've made the statement once before _ Again both scientific theories are far-fetched - just the notion that life can spring up spontaneous or the notion that organisms are alive in space. Yet they are continuing to find DNA and RNA on meteorites, so if that can exist in space _ God can exist ............ Almost every culture from the beginning has believed in a God or gods that came from the sky. I believe Yahweh/Elohim is his human given name.
I seriously doubt if any Christian has ever said free will changes or make Evolution fact or fiction - it's one's poor understanding, or just not listening to what they are actually saying......... Just your play on words!
Continue to write as you choose I said all I need to say - and I refuse to be participating any longer - goodbye again
@Gloomy despite the fact that God says what sin is - man also determines what sin is by moral standards and Lowe's are determined by that moral standard.
Seems like to me you would like a lawless society where everyone can do exactly what they please regardless to the consequences towards others. Chaos and havoc is what you will have.
And sin is not imposed on others _ people decide to commit sin, it is a choice. And regardless to whether you look at sin as sin it is still a choice of one's actions.
Where you live - your social life - your family life - how you were raised, what you eat, etc etc etc has nothing to do with whether you choose to do right or wrong. *It is a choice* unless you have some deep mental incapabilities / problems.
And it's not a contradiction - the word people is used for mankind as a whole - not each and every individual. And there are very few people if any who can honestly say they have not had some sort of sinful thoughts or desires something is simple as envy or lust.
No human puts murder and gay love on the same level you are in grave error
Seems like to me you would like a lawless society where everyone can do exactly what they please regardless to the consequences towards others. Chaos and havoc is what you will have.
No you only think that because you seem to think the concept of divine law and "sins" exist outside of religious doctrine and belief... it doesn't. Laws are not put into place on basis of divine laws in functioning countries. It rather seems to me like you support countries like Afghanistan under the Taliban that enforce religious laws.
Moral systems exist without the concept of some divine law.
Where you live - your social life - your family life - how you were raised, what you eat, etc etc etc has nothing to do with whether you choose to do right or wrong.
If you think a person born into wealth and a stable environment is in the same position to make choices as a person born into poverty and an abusive situation then you'd be wrong. Moral absolutism doesn’t exist and christianity isn't the metric by which we measure what is right and what is wrong.
@Gloomy oh please - where do you people come up with these concepts that only makes sense to you.
And the fact that you would even say moral absolutism doesn't exist supports people are sinful by nature _ wow!
You wrote I seem to think that the concept (meaning idea) of Divine law and "sins" exist outside of religious doctrine and belief ......... The Ten Commandments is considered Divine law ___ don't kill (crime) --- don't steal (crime) --- respect your neighbor's property ( can be criminal) ---- honor your parents (can be criminal) ----- don't commit adultery ( can this country **it "was" a crime and still is a crime in 16 States - and still can be criminal and positively accepted for means of divorce) and the other parts of the Ten Commandments are strictly moral. Think again about your statement considering the concept of laws in functioning countries.
I seem to support countries like Afghanistan and the Taliban the statement I made was based on the statement you made referring to your ideas.
And I never said a person born in a wealthy situation compared to a person born in a situational poorness were the same or would make the same decisions. I don't even know how you come up with that analogy................... A person's culture, nationality, skin tone, wealth, or poorness has nothing to do with making a choice between right and wrong/good and evil - if either of them steal, murder, rape, they are still wrong regardless of where they are in society and facing the penalties thereof if caught.......... Now a person of less or no fortune may make the wrong CHOICES because of their lack of necessities _ guess what, it was still their choice to make.
Goodbye ----- your reasoning is lacking reason - nothing else to say to you - write all you want.
Think again about your statement considering the concept of laws in functioning countries.
Most things in the 10 commandments are not unique to christianity and predate christianity and can be found in different moral systems. Only from your perspective it is divine law.
I seem to support countries like Afghanistan and the Taliban the statement I made was based on the statement you made referring to your ideas.
You want to apply divine law and bible based moral in a society. The Taliban are doing it from an Islam perspective the biblical enforcment would look similar.
good and evil
Typical black and white thinking. That's a bit infantile and has no application to reality. A person about to die from starvation stealing bread may be legally wrong but would it be morally wrong?
Your so called reasoning is immoral and based on the baseless assumption there is a god and to be specific the christian God
