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I Dislike People Who Are Uneducated, Ignorant Bigots

And what's further...

Speech is indeed a protected freedom in the US, but there are certain reasonable limits.
So, yes, you're right racist pigs are entitled to their opinions and they are even allowed to air them in public -- technically there's no crime there.
Buuuut...
The right to free speech had been refined through the decades through Supreme Court actions and there's something there for those that don't forget the role of each of the three branches of government. Laws made through Supreme Court decisions can't really be preventive like legislated laws, but they do still have weight -- as long as we don't forget them.
While the Court has always upheld the right to free speech it has encountered the exact situations that we saw this weekend and may see in the future if these White Supremacist rallies continue to be a thing. In the 1890s-1930s "anarchists" and "bolshevics" plagued the US and while their leaders got to conduct their free speech their followers occasionally shot, maimed, bombed and killed for the cause -- sometimes right after their gatherings.
This weekend David Duke and certain other racist leaders spoke publicly in Charlottesville. They spoke to the crowds and they were recorded. THEN shortly after the rallies were broken up one of their followers drove a car through a crowd of unarmed counter-protesters, killing one and injuring 19.
If Duke and/or any of his cohort said ANYthing that could be construed as permitting, suggesting demanding or even encouraging causing harm for their cause or saying that the gathered White Supremacists had a responsibility or duty to perform any dangerous action ...

THEN David Duke and others saying such things can and should be arrested for violating incendiary speech decisions like
"government could regulate any speaker who would counsel or advise a man to commit an unlawful act." Masses v. US 1917
and
"government could punish all speech, including advocacy of illegality, that had a tendency to encourage illegality."
and
"government could punish speakers who had the explicit intention of encouraging crime." (these 2 from 1920s decisions including the Beverage--Orchard case)
and
"a danger need not be very clear and present if the ultimate harm shall be very grave." Dennis v. US 1951
and
"where advocacy is directed to inciting or producing imminent lawless action and is likely to incite or produce such action." Brandenburg v. Ohio. 1969 - an actual KKK case.

In short someone needs to review the things Klan leaders said at the rally and if there's any chance that Fields could have taken them as permission or encouragement then it's time to issue warrants for the arrest of those leaders. Their speeches are probably on news services and YouTube right now.
Get 'em off the streets.
aqualovecrystal · 26-30, F
As a Canadian and a progressive, I come from a country with strong hate speech laws. I believe in protecting the rights of minorities and marginalized people and groups but hate speech laws specifically come with lots of unintended consequences. No matter the intention it effectively nullifies the human rights to free speech and expression.

In the US you take this right for granted, in Canada free speech is not a given right but something which the government can and will restrict as it pleases such as with recent pronoun laws and Islamophobia bills. Nobody should be in trouble for speech, only harmful/illegal action.

I really am sympathetic to people who want hate speech laws in the states but I urge them not to go down that road. Our Human Rights Tribunal is often called a kangaroo court. It deals with hate speech convictions. There is no due process that is a given in conventional law. Does this not violate a citizen's legal rights?

Hate speech laws are very bad for the radical left. Communists, anarchists and syndicalists, radical environmentalists, radical feminists etc. Hate speech laws could get them in trouble for false accusations of Antisemitism for being critical of Israel, bigotry against the rich for questioning the system of class etc.. Radfems have been accused of hate speech for having their own reasoning to why they find transgenderism homophobic and sexist. Too often hate speech accusations are used to silence even progressive thought. You think of right wing bigots but that is not the only people who are affected.
kayoshin · 36-40, M
@aqualovecrystal "Nobody should be in trouble for speech, only harmful/illegal action. " but hate speech is harmful think about terrorism recruiting propaganda, instigation to violence, instigation to rape, conspiracy to murder...
Nobody says laws are perfect and can't be used against the innocent by corrupt systems but by that logic we shouldn't have any kind of law because innocent get falsely accused. So taking this into consideration i can't agree with you, there isn't a need for less law, but one for less corruption.
aqualovecrystal · 26-30, F
@kayoshin There are better ways to support minorities than to create hate speech laws. First and foremost addressing their causes of poverty and lifting them out of it which capitalism can never really do. It cannot tackle the root causes of why certain groups are marginalized so it creates reformist band-aids like hate speech laws in the name of their protection.
kayoshin · 36-40, M
@aqualovecrystal so your point is if we can't do something nearly impossible we better not do anything at all? Seems a bit idealistic/naive to me.
The real world needs solutions that work NOW not in a future utopia the kind of change you talk about will take hundreds of years and god knows how many generations. That kind of change also takes swaying most of the population, which you won't be able to do with people dropping hate speech on them, there are always problems and hate speech is quick at pointing fingers and the people in suffering are also quick at dumping their hate at whoever the finger is pointing at.

I agree with you on paper or when thinking at humanity time scale, but for us and the few future generation there is no other option. Capitalism isn't going anywhere it's flawed, but humans make all the better systems impossible to use in real life because they always become a dictatorship.
SW-User
Very touching post...I´m with you.
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kayoshin · 36-40, M
@questionWeaver in case you didn't know in the UK the people vote the leaders as well and the royals are more or less symbolic not a real ruling power. If in the USA you the people vote and the gov doesn't do any parenting when is the last time you the people voted on a health system law? Any law? Oh wait you don't, the government does.
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kayoshin · 36-40, M
Lol i think you are confused England and UK are not the same thing it's like saying "Texas vs UK" England is just a state in the UK. USA is a superpower.. are we talking economy or military? Cause the dollar is a bitch compared to the pound, it's even lower than the euro, so an economic super power it might be but don't bark at the bigger dogs. If you want to brag about area The Commonwealth is on 2 continents and all it's dominions have strong economies. I'm not a fan of the UK or the Commonwealth but numbers don't lie.
Your governments are actually extremely similar, the UK is also comprised of states England, Ireland,Scotland, Whales, they all have a local form of government and then divided into local govs etc etc.
Don't confuse CULTURE with POLITICS. You do have the most individualistic culture but at the same time you're the biggest flag lovers after North Korea so that's a little weird contrast but doesn't have any bearing on how the law is made and applied, it only has a bearing on what crap politicians have to spit during election years :) .

 
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