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Grenfell tower block

This was and still is an absolute tragedy as the inquiry has started what do you see as the problem or problems to how the tower block caught fire and went up so quickly and what should be done about it or do you think it could be treated as Liverpool fans were after Hillsborough.

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WelshLovely · 46-50, F

A council determined to make a tower block in an affluent area look better for the well to do neighbours, whilst spending as little money as possible and not giving a damn about the residents safety.

They had enough money to do the job properly but didn't want to spend it on poor people. They should be charged with corporate manslaughter.

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milkymum1 · 31-35, F

@WelshLovely the council yes had the responsibility for the building but also so did the builders who used cheaper not to standard goods but also so does the government as there own fire safety expect signed the fire certificate.

WelshLovely · 46-50, F

The council own the building and whatever excuses or other parties they decide should share the responsibilities, they're the ones who employed the contractors and knew damned well that the work wasn't safe. They shouldn't have needed to hide behind someone with a clipboard ticking boxes and they had a moral duty to the residents. They were ultimately in charge and also did nothing to help in the aftermath.

milkymum1 · 31-35, F

@WelshLovely im not saying there hiding behind someone with a clip board what im syaing its not just the council to blame, everyone involved from the council to the contractors to the government are all involoved along the line becuase this isnt just about grenfell its about all the other flats/buildings across the uk whcih are all covered in the same outer cladding.

Peppa · 31-35, F

I think that nothing will ever really come of it. Because the damage was done and continued to be done in the weeks after. Officially because and I believe, because it was a block lived in by many foreign people. Unfortunately it turned out many residents were under investigation anyways for subletting. So I feel generally they didn't really give a toss about the residents as it sounded like "management wise" they were struggling to manage it. [b]whilst keeping other posh kensington residents happy[/b]
I hope they won't keep shifting the blame and just all involved take ownership for the mistakes made I.e if there were people okaying materials they knew were harmful and it was written somewhere that it was dangerous just to come out with it.

My Nan always says everything in the dark always comes to light one way or another so unless companies start shredding or burning files they will find it.
And compensation bloody hell, there really is no compensation that can cover the massive loss they all had.

I'd just like to add on a Final note the speed to which they were able to convict those residents that lied to be able to make a claim is the same haste they should use in dealing with this

milkymum1 · 31-35, F

@Peppa its what i was thinking to the council and government have tried to push the blame away to the businesses who did it all and they have pushed the blame back.

all of them knew the cost cutting the saving money on using cheaper not to standard products so they are all to blame and should be made accountable but what i see is no one these days wants that and try to pass it on, a little like Hillsbough

my dad says what goes around comes around they wanted to uses cheaper quality goods not up to standards then they have to face the consequences when it goes wrong

yes its amazing they track down and prosecute people who lied about losing people in the tower blcok but when it comes to doing the same to people who are easy to find it never happens.

TopOfTheWorld

@Peppa unfortunately there are still many fraudulent claims to be investigated, which takes up the time of those trying to help the genuine victims.

Peppa · 31-35, F

@TopOfTheWorld but they just be put on hold temporarily until the tower is completed if a person us due compensation but under investigation for fraud that then needs to be taken into account because if the victim is due to repay, they should seize what is owed and whatever left given to them. It's only right and fair. Because had the fraud case been closed before they would have ruled repayment/jail time if necessary. And should they happen to fall on any fortune usually that is deemed as going towards repayment as it would need to be declared.
But I'm sure they'll say differently.

Picklebobble2 · 56-60, M

Somebody was responsible for ensuring the place was fit for habitation.
From all we've heard so far, nobody has taken responsibility for the fact that it clearly wasn't !
So who dropped the ball ?
Building inspectors ? Local council ? H&SE ? As a communal block, it needed a fire safety certificate issued by the Fire Brigade.
Did it ever get one ? Was it current at the time of the fire ?
Not going to be pretty and relatives of the dead are going to demand somebody be held accountable.

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Picklebobble2 · 56-60, M

@milkymum1 Keep watching. See how many suddenly take 'early retirement', retire due to 'ill-health', get cut loose by the companies they work for as the enquiry goes on.

Peppa · 31-35, F

@Picklebobble2 but just like with these celebs who are being investigated years after their crimes were committed, long after they've "retired", some are still having to face trial so that doesn't offer them a pass. That only offers them time to appreciate the last few months of freedom they should have. Anyone and I mean anyone else that caused such a catastrophic fire without external input would be held accountable, and because of that so should they. This is why companies take on indemnity insurance etc. But usually they are saved when they are not knowing in their wrong doing whereas it seems it was purposely done.

milkymum1 · 31-35, F

@Picklebobble2 early retirement with a golden handshake too

SW-User

I think this will reverberate for years to come.

milkymum1 · 31-35, F

@SW-User yes like hillsbourgh done on the tory watch will carry on

Quizzical · 46-50, M

In my opinion the council are fully culpable

milkymum1 · 31-35, F

@Quizzical what about the builders the contrcters and the government?

Burnley123 · 41-45, M

I think the Hillsborough analogy works. It has a lot to do with cuts in local government, outsourcing of a contracts and weak (and even weaker enforced) safety regulation.

We can blame individuals but the problems are also systemic.

milkymum1 · 31-35, F

@Burnley123 thanks to me its all similar, both under tory rule, tried to sweep them both under the rug and blame everyone else other than themselves and not to admit its thier poilices which have led to all of this

Burnley123 · 41-45, M

@milkymum1 Agree. I'm an acting member of the Labour Party

sometimeslonelytoo · 51-55, M

This disaster was ... a bit too close to home. Devastating to see the block driving past soon thereafter :(

milkymum1 · 31-35, F

@sometimeslonelytoo yes it must be heart breaking to see everyday and to know other tower blocks are the same.

sometimeslonelytoo · 51-55, M

I mean... the scale of it, and how absolutely blackened it was... photos just don't have that effect, though they did show it when it was actually on fire. I mean to be present there, it's almost palpable, the feel of loss of lives. Very, upsetting :(

milkymum1 · 31-35, F

@sometimeslonelytoo no phots or tv fottage never does show the scale or the devistation .

bhatjc · 46-50, M

To many people living in a small space. And the building should never have been built. Ruins the skyline

milkymum1 · 31-35, F

@bhatjc yes it is but a lot of places here are tower blocks and it was the outer cladding of the building which was one of the faults

bhatjc · 46-50, M

@milkymum1 Yes. Also the people in the building didn't have fire drills

SuicideBiProxy2 · 36-40, M

I hope these housing estates get turned into condos. Ship the poor to Wales.

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