Politics
No Notifications
Only logged in members can reply and interact with the post.
Join SimilarWorlds for FREE »

Should Spain pay homage to Catalonia?

Things have just been escalated by the Rajoy Government in Madrid. Catalan regional autonomy has been suspended and direct rule imposed. It's like the US federal government suspending the legislature of a major state. Nothing like this has happened in modern times.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/oct/22/spain-calls-on-catalans-to-respect-decision-to-impose-direct-rule

My own view is that I support the Catalan's right to have a referendum on grounds of democracy and self determination, even though I think Catalan independence would be a bad idea. This is an autocratic decision by Rajoy. It's legal within the Spanish constitution but that is not the point. There is no good defence for it on ethical grounds and it will make a difficult situation worse.
Burnley123
41-45, M
34 replies 60 views Oct 22, 2017
Share Link
Top | Newest First | Oldest First
Northwest · M
Yes, I think it's not a great move on the part of Spain. The autonomy move, went a bit too far for Catalonia as well. It may be true that they're keeping the national economy afloat, but Catalonia's success could not have come if it had been a country on its own.

This does, however, bring back the ghost of Franco, as far as Catalonians are concerned.
+ 2 · Reply · Translate · Oct 22, 2017
This comment is hidden. Show Comment
SatanBurger · 36-40, F
@LvChris I get half a story? Sorry but police don't have the right to rip ballots out of people's hands. When I saw that it made me angry. They could have done it and handled it a different way. The govt has far bigger things to worry about than people wanting to gain independence. Like murderers, rapists, thieves, etc. Like maybe figuring out how to have better schools, trying to clear pollution, working out how to pay teachers more, taking care of gang violence.

You know like.. things that matter. If supporting independence and thinking it's wrong to treat citizens in that manner makes me a horrible person than so be it Chris. I wouldn't want to know your opinion of a good person.
+ 0 · Reply · Translate · Oct 23, 2017 · Edited: 6 yrs ago
Northwest · M
@LvChris [quote]Tillerson issued a statement to the Iranian folks that are there. "Come on, guys, you should head home now."[/quote]

Tillerson was visiting Saudi Arabia, when he made that statement. The problem is that the militias ARE home. When Iraq was run by Saddam, a Sunni, supported by the GCC (before he invaded Kuwait), the Shiite leadership fled to Iran, and now they're back home, and support Iran.

The Iranians are not going home anytime soon, and there's nothing we can do about it, otherwise than paying lip service to the Saudis.
+ 0 · Reply · Translate · Oct 23, 2017
This comment is hidden. Show Comment
SW-User
I stand with you. Independence would be bad but my god Spain fucked up.
+ 2 · Reply · Translate · Oct 22, 2017
bijouxbroussard · F
I’m still trying to educate myself on that situation before deciding what I think. I know how I’ve felt when someone with no understanding of my country’s history or political contradictions wades in and offers an oversimplified “opinion”. So I’m trying not to do that. My knee jerk reaction is that if a majority of Catalans want to separate from Spain, why not ? But these things are [b]never[/b] as simple as they look from the outside. 🤔
+ 3 · Reply · Translate · Oct 23, 2017
CountScrofula · 41-45, M
@bijouxbroussard I'm with you on that all I really have is an instinct to side with the underdog. But not many people are writing on why Catalan wants to separate.
+ 3 · Reply · Translate · Oct 23, 2017
CountScrofula · 41-45, M
I'm just pleased with the Orwell reference. Love that book.

That said.. yeah I basically agree with you. It's probably a terrible idea economically for Catalan to separate but it's also the ethical thing to let them hold a fair vote.
+ 1 · Reply · Translate · Oct 23, 2017
SW-User
It's a bad situation, worse because it's motivated by money..
Spain is broke.. Catalonian independence would lead to bankruptcy and national default..
+ 1 · Reply · Translate · Oct 22, 2017
Burnley123 · 41-45, M
@SW-User It is motivated by money and Catalonia is a relatively rich region. It's also about Rajoy playing the tough guy to his own nationalist base and about distraction from the economic problems.

Working class Spaniard, the rich and my corrupt government are not your enemies, its the Catalans.
+ 2 · Reply · Translate · Oct 22, 2017 · Edited: 6 yrs ago
Cierzo · M
Rajoy did the right thing, enforcing the constitution. When someone goes against the law, is given a chance to correct themselves, and reject it, they get what they deserve.

Independentist Catalonians may feel even more victimized by this move? Probably, but everyone is responsible for their own feelings. We cannot act on the basis of not hurting everyone else's feelings, but on the basis of what is right or wrong.
+ 0 · Reply · Translate · Oct 23, 2017
SmartKat · 56-60, F
When people want to leave, it’s a mistake to try to force them to stay. That’s true both in relationships, and in countries (IMHO.)

In my own country, we had the American Civil War to force the southern states that had seceded to rejoin the U.S. And look how well that has turned out. Maybe Lincoln should have let them go, but used the money and resources wasted on the war to help the slaves escape from the south, instead.
+ 0 · Reply · Translate · Oct 22, 2017
DonaldTrumpet · 70-79, M
ID just NuKe Em
+ 1 · Reply · Translate · Oct 22, 2017
This comment is hidden. Show Comment
DonaldTrumpet · 70-79, M
+ 0 · Reply · Translate · Oct 23, 2017
SatanBurger · 36-40, F
After what they just pulled, Spain has no right to demand respect.
+ 0 · Reply · Translate · Oct 23, 2017
Burnley123 · 41-45, M
Deliberate Orwell reference btw. Big fan.
+ 0 · Reply · Translate · Oct 22, 2017
 
Post Comment