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Trump + Drones = Civilian Deaths

Remember when Obama was called the "Drone King?" And people were RIGHTFULLY upset by the number of civilian deaths?

According to AirWars, which chronicles Coalition air strike data, the Trump administration killed more civilians in 9 months than the Obama Administration did in 8 years.

The estimates are as high as 4,500.

That's 4,500 INNOCENT people, already living in a war zone, who have lost their lives. And we question why so many in the Middle East want to take revenge?

Wouldn't you?

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RemovedUsername8862 · 26-30, M

Yes, and I think anybody with a cursory understanding of human nature would understand why Afghanis, Iraqis, Pakistanis, Yemenis, and Somalis would want revenge for civilian deaths.

The problem, as I see it, is that these deaths cannot be taken back, the blood spilt cannot be restored. It is what economists call a sunk cost. This means that if whatever objective the strikes were conducted towards is dropped or whatnot, that sunk cost will be completely lost, with nothing to show but a pile of dead civilians. It's too late to turn back from this course, I think, because the drone campaign has escalated tension to the point where steady pressure has to be applied to check the understandable revenge that would come our way.

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RemovedUsername8862 · 26-30, M

@Ynotisay I agree - such thinking is unacceptable: Killing civilians does nothing but increase the number of enemies, unless you're willing to go to the logical conclusion and begin emulating the Nazi occupation of Poland.

Unfortunately, I don't know if anybody has a good handle on counter-insurgency or anti-guerilla doctrine that doesn't involve removing the civilian population from the target area one way or the other. The fact that asymmetrical warfare tactics greatly reward conducting operations in civilian areas doesn't help.

Ynotisay · M

@RemovedUsername8862 Here's what I equate it to. Training a dog. If you want a dog to behave you don't punish the action after the fact. A dog who shits on the floor at 2 doesn't understand why it's being punished at 4. But if you treat the CAUSE of the behavior before it takes place, instead of responding to the symptom after the fact, the behavior will change.
We continue to think eliminating people will eliminate the mindset. Doesn't work that way. And until the REASONS people become indoctrinated are considered and dealt with (poverty being the big one) we're on a continual treadmill of death.

RemovedUsername8862 · 26-30, M

@Ynotisay Yup. And the roots of the conflict are incredibly deep, stretching back at least as far as World War One, to say nothing of the US interventions in the Soviet Invasion of Afghanistan, the Iran-Iraq War, the Iranian political scene pre-revolution, or the support given to the brutal theocratic monarchy of Saudi Arabia and the support given to Israel.

Problem is, the scars caused are deep and aggravating, and I don't know if they're reconcilable, especially when the population of the US is still scared of Islamist insurgency and terrorism, and Wahhabists continue to deliberately inflame populations against governments and factions backed by the US. It's hard to defuse a situation when both sides are locked in struggle.

ChampagneOnIce · 51-55, F

Wow! Really? That’s awful! No wonder America is so hated.

nakedguyVII · 61-69, M

Thank you presenting this web site.

What a bunch of hypocrites. Fighting terrorist. Yet All the countries in the coalitions are the worlds leaders with terrorists actions with those drones.

bijouxbroussard · F

Well, let’s see if anyone else will mention this—without finding a way to “explain” how this time it’s “different”. 🤔

RemovedUsername8862 · 26-30, M

@bijouxbroussard I'm of the opinion that it isn't different in the slightest - the drone campaign was one of the primary reasons that I disliked the Obama administration when they were in power, and it does less than nothing to endear me to our Glorious Leader.

bijouxbroussard · F

@RemovedUsername8862 I wasn’t happy with that, either, although it made me wonder how conservatives could claim Obama was “coddling” them.

RemovedUsername8862 · 26-30, M

@bijouxbroussard Probably because those people are the first to point to ethnic cleansing as a "solution".

Virgo79 · 61-69, M

I say just stop it all and let them kill all us.
Problem solved right

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Virgo79 · 61-69, M

@Ynotisay you had your opportunity to give the solution to the problem.
You don't have one, you just want to bitch about it.
Read wellwishers post, then think about what were dealing with.

Ynotisay · M

@Virgo79 Blah blah blah. Guess it's commercial time on FOX. Yeah dude. Thousands of innocent people being wiped out, which only leads to more innocent people being wiped out, tends to grab my attention.
What doesn't are gutless fools sitting behind computers beating their chests as if they were strong but are only showing themselves to be weak. No time for that. I'm done.
MAGA dude.

Virgo79 · 61-69, M

@Ynotisay in at work dumb fuck.
Got a job?

SW-User

Hmmm, remind me how many innocent civilians died on 9/11 again?

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Ynotisay · M

@SW-User FAR FAR less than the number of civilians who have been killed since that date by U.S forces. Not even close. And in countries, and against groups, that had nothing to do with 9/11.
Sorry dude. That was a bullshit comment.

lorne13 · 61-69, M

@SW-User do you want to be reminded that tbe 911 attackers were Saudis and Saudi Arabia is still a US allie?

RemovedUsername8862 · 26-30, M

@SW-User How is that relevant? You killed a civilian, so I'm going to do the same? How does that make anything any better?

Also, if we're talking numbers, current estimates have the death toll of the "War on Terror" in the neighborhood of 1.3 to 2 million civilian deaths.

TJNewton · M

Yes but trump eats chocolate cake and burgers in bed at 6.30pm when this is happening

This message was deleted by the author of the main post.

Ynotisay · M

@coolboy86 Deleting your post. This is a grown up topic. No room for the kids.

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