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I Think That When Guns Are Outlawed Only Outlaws Will Have Gun

Many are shouting about keeping guns out of the hands of the mentally ill. Like the others it is a feel good solution that will have dire consequences and will have zero effectiveness in curbing the violence.

Mental illness can be very hard to identify since there is no kind of official test for most conditions, most people are diagnosed according to the [b]subjective[/b] opinions of the doctors that observe them. What makes anyone think that a doctor is neutral? We have seen plenty of activist judges, doctors are human as well and many have an agenda!

In the dictionary of mental illnesses, known as DSM-5, published by the American Psychiatric Association, there is actually a condition listed for people who have a problem with authority. Oppositional Defiant Disorder is a name that psychiatrists made up to identify children who won’t do what they are told, and now even adults are being diagnosed with this condition as well. It important to note it is doctors that sit around a conference table deciding what goes into the DSM. The DSM is a tool that is used so when diagnosed they can prescribe. Note also that big pharma spends aprox 40K per year per doctor to get them to prescribe.

A policy like this could also allow the government to disarm dissidents and political enemies. As psychiatry became more influential towards the middle of the 20th century, rulers around the world began using “mental illness” as an excuse to lock away anyone who might disagree with them. The Soviet regime became notorious for this practice by labeling all political dissidents as “mentally ill” so they could be locked away in institutions where they were no threat to the establishment.

The United States government also has a long history of slapping unruly citizens with the mark of mental illness. President Franklin Roosevelt famously called his detractors “the lunatic fringe.

Meanwhile, politicians and mainstream media are quick to label anyone who questions the official narrative as a “conspiracy theorist,” a term that has been falsely associated with mental illness in pop culture.

A study in 2017 set out to determine whether or not believing in conspiracy theories was a form of mental illness. As expected they found the exact answer that they were looking for, people who don’t trust the government and mainstream media are crazy, and suffering from something called illusory pattern perception.

The mentally ill are more likely to be victims as they appear weak than they are to commit a violent crime. We don't need more gun laws what we need is to stop the drugs that doctors hand out in order to increase their profits. These drugs are very well known to cause violent behavior as these poisons change your brain chemistry.

The common denominator of all the mass shootings starting with Columbine is they were all on drugs legally prescribed by doctors. MSM downplays that because it is big pharma paying for them. We want to stop the violence we need to stop the drugs.

http://docshare01.docshare.tips/files/20788/207888145.pdf
acpguy · C
Why are we not banning cell phones in autos and if a person uses a cell phone in an accident then why are we not putting them in prison for murder as we do with someone using a gun? I have seen some accidents reported that were committed by a politician that killed someone while the politician was either drunk, texting or on drugs. We had one here just recently in SD and the most famous was Ted Kennedy which caused a pretty young lady to die. Since Ted was a famous liberal he was never thrown in jail or tired for murder. Liberals are so stupid they cannot get their heads out of their anal orifices to see the truth or admit to it.
Oster1 · M
The overwhelming number of legal gun owners, commit the fewest crimes. This is just a fact!😊
TexChik · F
@Oster1 yep , and my Guns don’t go on shooting rampages either ( for those who say Guns cause violence)
Oster1 · M
👍 So true!😊@TexChik
TexChik · F
Unfortunately libs will say only conservatives are mentally ill ... when most mass shootings are carried out by unhinged democrats
acpguy · C
@TexChik They are most often the ones that commit suicide by gun also. Many suicides by gun are listed as gun deaths or gun violence by the liberal controlled cities / states. They gotta raise those numbers up so they can beat on gun ownership.
SW-User
So well put!
acpguy · C
@Tracos What socialist kind of world are you from. I see you are too cowardly to show it on your profile.
SW-User
U americans believe gns protect u against someone bad. But most of the time guns in most American households kill there own families in accidents. If a group of americans wanted to take over the country it probably wouldn't be hard with how many people have guns and how easeu can buy them. I'm surprised trump is still alive not been shot yet.
2cool4school · 46-50, F
@SW-User tHnkS Fer yorE In puut. 👌
TexChik · F
@SW-User you are completely full of shit . Nothing you said is true
callis40 · 41-45, M
stop the violence remove the guns its not rocket science. yes people can still kill with knives but not at the same level as someone with an assult rifle. its america 2021, you put people on the moon and have achieved so much yet your gun control in some ways is sooo backwards.
TexChik · F
@callis40 we have Guns as part of our guaranteed rights because of you brits . They will not be going away .
callis40 · 41-45, M
@TexChik because of us brits? what is that suppost to mean.......stop living in the past and move on. no one is going to invade america, your more of a threat to yourselves then others invading you. but dont worry just keep on letting peopel shoot up your kids!!!!

so sad
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SW-User
What is wrong with the mentally I'll having guns they will just kill them selves mostly
Serkan · 61-69, M
MrBrownstone · 46-50, M
Remember when the British told the colonies to give up their guns?
Mikemcneil · 61-69, M
Which gun laws are criminals breaking? Guns are easy to obtain in the USA legally or not. That's because there are over three hundred million guns in circulation.
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2cool4school · 46-50, F
@Waymore it’s an oversimplified argument. There is no “magic bullet” solution. Pardon my analogy no pun intended. And it’s not going to change soon. It’s part of the US economy in many cases (yes not all guns are made here.) But most all brands types variants etc are sold to the US market. Even foreign gun companies don’t want that to change. So it’s a multi headed problem. One head shot won’t fix this.
AlphaCuckTX · 56-60, M
I'll just leave this here...
lorne13 · 61-69, M
@AlphaCuckTX he was in the government, he should know
therighttothink50 · 56-60, M
@AlphaCuckTX And when those words are uttered by a huckster type Marxist like Obama, we need to run for the hills.
AlphaCuckTX · 56-60, M
@therighttothink50 You run for the hills. I live in the country and have guns.
Ynotisay · M
What study was that again about conspiracy theories correlating to mental illness?

I'll assume you didn't write the headline. Which is nonsense. My response would be "Japan." The outlaws wouldn't stop having guns over night. But it would happen.

I'm also STILL waiting for a list of the elected official calling for a ban on all guns. Think I'll be waiting a while. But again, I'll assume you didn't write the headline.

But I'm not sure you really looked in to what denotes mental illness when it comes to guns. Almost seems like you're fighting for the rights of the mentally ill to access weapons. You're arguing two different things here under, I'm assuming, the premise of "They're comin' to take my guns."

You said that "all" the mass killings since Columbine involved a shooter on prescribed medication. Are you sure about that? Really, REALLY sure? Because "all" is a big word. I'd just have to go with "Pulse Nightclub" to blow up the 'all.'

But your MSM reference makes a lot of what you said pretty clear.

But out of curiosity, and as one who is ADAMANTLY opposed to the ridiculous number of Americans using prescription medication (most in the world) as well as the power of the big pharma, did you ever think that the reason so many of the mass murderers are on, or were on, prescription drugs is because they're mentally ill? So if they weren't on the drugs you'd still want them to access firearms legally?

Sorry. Not buying it.

But you DID put together a solid argument. Thanks for that.
Great post! You are correct about how politicians will use "mental illness" as a method to control others.

For those that have never read the 45 goals of communism, please do an internet search.
It is a quick, but extremely disturbing read. It was presented as part of the Congressional record 1963. Read goal #39 below:

39. Dominate the psychiatric profession and use mental health laws as a means of gaining coercive control over those who oppose Communist goals.

Has your doctor asked you if there are firearms in the house? If the doctor ever asks, your answer is no.
@Mikemcneil hahaha! Ahhh...what happened to all the little hearts you used to send me privately back on EP? Now you show your true leftists colors with pathetic insults. Typical of low sloping foreheaded, knuckle dragging morons such as yourself.
Mikemcneil · 61-69, M
@BizSuitStacy little 💕? That must have been before I realised you were a right wing card carrying nut job I guess. Thanks for showing your true colours. 😁
Mikemcneil · 61-69, M
No witty comeback on your Vegas brother? Quelle surprise! White middle age terrorism is just fine by the NRA apparently. Thousands of rounds of ammo and ten lethal weapons is perfectly acceptable. He was protecting his family obviously..... 😰
Moosepantspatty · 31-35, M
I honestly find myself really confused about all of this. The constitution is plain about government not being lawfully allowed to legislate its contents without a constitutional convention.

But here we are, nearly all of the original 10 amendments have been legislated on without proper process, and everybody wants more.

Why not do it properly instead of dividing the people based on opinions?
Moosepantspatty · 31-35, M
@Mikemcneil is Americas current situation worse than being wracked by a war on our own land against a global superpower? Is Americas current levels of corruption higher than those of the corrupt monarchy that we went to war with for our freedom? Is Americas debt greater than a fledgling country who just cut ties with their creditors?

The founding fathers saw terror far beyond anything we experience today.

To answer your question though, I place such an emphasis on their anachronistic view, because it is the law that each and every one of us is bound to abide by, by the very government you have entrusted to keep you safe. Follow it.

However, as much as I would hope that my incredibly mild viewpoint would help ease misunderstandings and tensions, it has become clear that you are either not reading, or not comprehending what it is I am saying, instead you continue to ignore the most basic facts of the conversation to bring up more contentious points that would be better discussed with someone who will happily spew their own bias back at you.

Good day sir, and best of luck in all of your endeavors.
@Moosepantspatty by engaging in debate with Mike, you are dealing with a socialist.

Like many socialists, Mike's real problem is he wants to dictate how you and I should live. They simply can't keep their collectivist noses out of our business.

This is exactly why we have the constitution to begin with, and why it's never going to be an outdated document.
SW-User
@Mikemcneil Cause they're not so anachronistic, and what's more, we can change the laws and the Constitution, but it requires a significant amount of approval, not just 50.1%
SW-User
I am British and we do not allow guns. Most people here go through their entire lives and never know any violence at all. Criminals who have guns tend to shoot other criminals. I would never visit US as it seems lawless and dangerous. At the very least ( if I ever had to visit) I would want a bullet proof vest.
SW-User
@St0ut I generally block headcases. You are no exception !
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It is time to get rid of the AR-15s.
There are 5 to 10 million of them in the public hands that don't need them.
A handgun should be enough unless You think the zombie apocalypse is coming soon.
Riverman · 56-60, M
With all the craziness, evil criminal acts, and a potential hostile government, I think an argument could be made that it is insane to NOT be armed.
Ynotisay · M
@Riverman Yeah. You're armed. Because you don't have the stones not to be. Clear as day bud. I give exactly two fucks about your life. But I do care that there's too many people like you out there. We live in a gutless country. So thanks for contribution dude.
Riverman · 56-60, M
@Ynotisay Thank you for the attacks.
Ynotisay · M
@Riverman You're welcome.
luv2fish · 61-69, M
I agree with you. Cars kill more people than guns, but you don't hear people trying to outlaw cars. One thing I have noticed in mass shootings, often the person has been oppressed, whether by bullying, being ridiculed, or in some way belittled. Their anger builds inside of them until they finally lash out and for awhile, they are the ones in control. They are not being bullied anymore. Between that and mental illness, I personally believe that is at the bottom of these horrific crimes. The people that do it are to blame as much as the people that belittle the shooters earlier in their lives. We need to stop bullying and respect one another as human beings!!! That goes for everyone.
@luv2fish who told you that? Outlaws have guns because we have a freaking Christmas sale on them. In fact “outlaws” in Mexico are purchasing their killing devices from our soil. Safety is just an excuse to satisfy a lust for that power to intimidate and end life. NRA made us all junkies and we can’t stop the madness. Who cares about kids lives as long as our sickening lust for guns is satisfied.
@luv2fish most developed nations have extreme control on guns n guess what? Their outlaws are not killing by the dozens. We are competing for highest ranked deaths by guns with one of the most dangerous places on earth. Do we have most mentally ill people? I don’t think so.
TexChik · F
@luv2fish and have you noticed , with Obama out of office , mass shootings are nearly non existent now
Here are some thoughts:
1. Country with most guns per capita: US. Followed by Serbia and Yemen.
2. US tops the charts amongst developed nations in the highest gun related deaths category.

Banning or pumping more guns is not the solution. We must learn from other countries
1. How can we make law enforcement more effective?
2. Why are we preparing ourselves for an event (protecting from government) that is unlikely to happen. Didn’t we vote for them in the first place? If we are so paranoid about the government, let’s change it.
3. Self defense: do you really need a weapon that can take out an entire enemy unit in a minute?
And please stop comparing guns with automobiles. Automobiles are not built for maximum lethal damage. Guns are.
@curiosi and the way you threatened me with your right to bear arms is the problem with people these days. My dad is just like that. After receiving a threat from our neighbor with a shotgun because our dog trespassed their lawn, he made sure he always has the upper hand in the intimidation game. Thank you ma’am for helping me make my point here :)
St0ut · 51-55, M
@Texanfire explain Brazil please
@Texanfire - I agree that the US has the most guns. However, countries such as Mexico, Brazil and Venezuela all have more firearm homicides than the US. Several other nations simply have more homicides. I'm not sure if that fits the definition of "developed nation" or not. I've also never heard an explanation as to why the term "developed nation" was injected into that saying.

You bring up interesting questions. To your question about how can we make law enforcement more effective? I would ask...more effective at what? Law enforcement responds to events and situations. Their role is not as much preventative as it is reactionary. In that regard, if you are faced with a life or death scenario with seconds to respond, chances are the police are several minutes away.

Then the question about preparing for government tyranny. Unlikely event? Just ask the Venezuelans who have been disarmed...they didn't believe that a tyranous socialist dictator would disarm them first, and take over their lives, but it just happened. It's happened multiple times throughout history. People with first hand experience as holocaust survivors tell stories of how they were disarmed first. They tell us, "don't give up your guns." Yet for some reason, people don't believe it could happen here in the US? As long as Americans have the right to keep and bear arms, that possibility is reduced considerably.

So let's move onto self defense. What's this about a weapon that can take out an entire enemy unit? Who do you know that has one of those? Oh wait...you don't. Unless you personally know of some terrorists with access to artillery and rockets? Maybe heavy duty .50 cal machine guns? This is such a tired argument that has no basis other than to take us down the slippery slope of a full on gun ban.

The idea is to scare people who know nothing about guns. Want to know the difference between an AR-15 rifle and a Beretta M9 9mm pistol? One of those guns is a true weapon of war. The other is an AR-15. This is the stupidest of all the gun grabbing arguments. EVERY SINGLE conceivable firearm available to the public...semi-automatic rifles, pistols and shotguns, pump action shotguns, bolt action rifles, and even revolvers, has been and is still being used by our military.

Want to go down the "need" path...you know, the bit where someone says you don't need a gun like that...think again. There are 1.1 million home invasions in the US each year. On average, there are three perpetrators involved. Typically they are armed. In that case having an AR-15 or an AK-47 would multiple 30 round magazines is a NEED. You are far more likely to be a victim of a home invasion that you are as a victim in a mass shooting. Millions of citizens own sporting rifles like these. Let's quit pretending owning a firearm like an AR-15 or an AK-47 is something radical and extreme.

As far as guns and cars are concerned. I'll stop comparing car and gun deaths the minute grabbers promise to stop saying, "we have to have to register and have a license for our cars, so why not guns too?" You can't have it both ways.
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curiosi · 61-69, F
@Waymore Now everyone starts out with "I suffer from" doctors have everyone convinced nothing is their responsibility because they have a litany of disorders.
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fazer1k · 56-60, M
The best way to stop gun violence is to remove guns from the general public. America is always going to have a high level of gun crime because access to guns is so easy. Statistics from other countries that have introduced gun control prove this, plus it's rather obvious anyway - no one can carry out shootings without access to guns.
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CantExplain · 61-69, M
It’s pretty obvious in gun control cities like Chicago and New York that gun control doesn’t stop criminals from owning guns
hertoy · 70-79, M
Well thought out & well written. However I think a law prohibiting murder would make society much safer...wait, there is such a law.........
SW-User
"The common denominator of all the mass shootings..."
Is guns.
curiosi · 61-69, F
@SW-User Guns have been around since the founding of the country. Did you not know that??
Tiusflow · 61-69, M
Good point. I keep hearing about the need for red flag laws where a friend or relative can tell the police they think it is unsafe for you to own a gun and they can take your gun away without any due process.
I am on meds for depression. Does that mean I don't have the right to defend myself? I am sure my radical left wing siblings don't think I do. So does that give them the right to disarm me?
TexChik · F
Libs will try to control the definition of what constitutes poor mental health .
Peaches · F
I agree, but WHY are so many on drugs to begin with?!😕So many these daze are depressed, out of work, people can barley afford housing?! The whole world is going crazy in my opinion🌏😵and I don't see it getting any better soon?!
curiosi · 61-69, F
@Peaches We humans have this tendency to want to take the easy way out. They believe the campaigns that push that you will feel wonderful just by taking this pill. Life is difficult, and the only way through is to keep pushing forward. Like an athlete feels the burn yet keeps going.
Peaches · F
@curiosi Well and the doctors get all kinds of kick backs from the pharmaceutical companies. 😒 Yes you're right, people want the easy way out no matter where you look!
SW-User
I think easy access to guns creates more outlaws at a faster rate. The important thing is to have an effective police force, and this is more likely to happen if guns are heavily restricted.
acpguy · C
@SW-User Not very bright are you snowflake. If you remove guns and bullets from the good people then you end up with places like Nazis Germany, Cuba, Venezuela, Iran and other places that were taken over by governments gone bad. Having a death penalty for murder, enforcing it, limiting it to only one appeal and mandating it be carried out within one year of sentencing would help a lot. Today liberal courts like those in California allow criminals to go free after a short time or without any. Life imprisonment costs taxpayers lots of money and is not much of a deterrent despite what liberals argue. Allowing good people to carry guns and having the legal system back them up when used to kill a bad guy would also help but many liberal controlled states will not allow or hinder good people to carry guns and in those states the crime rates are the highest. My state allows concealed carry and we have a very low crime and murder rate. Almost 99% of murders committed are between drug people or minorities who many times have turned out to be illegal aliens.
callis40 · 41-45, M
sadly there are too many guns in the american system and too much money in guns with all the shops etc. the 2nd ammendment, note its an ammendment so can be changed.......is not an excuess for owning a gun. people like guns and as long as trained and given to the right person then fine. more sticter checks, proper training and handling maybe every two years. commit a crime, fail to do training, post gangster style pics on social media then lose the right to bear arms. harsher pens for those who breake the law. stop selling automatic weapons for a start you dont need an assult rifle( hint in the name) for defence.....
Virgo79 · 61-69, M
@callis40 in the U.s. to own an automatic weapon you need a class 3 federal firearms license, they don't just pass those out.
SW-User
That's so patently obvious, yet, the gun control mob can't seem to accept the simplest most readily verifiable fact.
TexChik · F
@SW-User
SW-User
@TexChik You are so on it TexChik, but the opposing views always ignores inconvenient facts.
Mikemcneil · 61-69, M
Guns and access are the problem. There isn't going to be any government crackdowns on responsible owners. That's a fallacy perpetrated by the NRA and Republicans.
TexChik · F
It’s far too subjective and libs would declare everyone insane
curiosi · 61-69, F
@TexChik Exactly!
TexChik · F
@curiosi and of course the 2A says “ shall not be infringed “ not “ make stupid shit up “ ! 😉
@TexChik exactly! We've already seen scenarios in which doctors are asking patients if they own a gun.

Suddenly, the doctor who's also a left wing dipshit may refer you to a shrink.

Or even more plausible...your health insurance carrier sees gun owner and raises your premiums, making gun ownership too expensive. Or even worse, the country falls down the hill of socialism to the extend our health care system is managed by gov't bureaucrats.
luv2fish · 61-69, M
Just thinking about all of the politicians that are against gun ownership. How many of them have armed security detail?
Doomflower · 36-40, M
As someone with mental illness I don't feel like I need a gun in the first place so win win.
SW-User
Do you have evidence that the shooters were all on meds? I would like to see that.
SW-User
@curiosi I will have to go through that thoroughly, but some of those drugs are well known to cause suicidal ideation or suicide in teens. Meds such as Zoloft require 6 weeks to be effective. Teens, especially troubled teens, are not able to deal with the length of time they have to wait. When they are not immediately fixed, they often take drastic actions. The parents are supposed to be closely monitoring their progress.

The other thing is that you are confusing correlation with causation. An easy example is this: The more alcohol you drink, the higher your chances are of getting lung cancer. However, alcohol does not cause lung cancer. There is a confounding variable. In this case it is smoking. The more people drink, the more time they spend at bars. Bars tend to also get smokers. The smoke inhalation caused the lung cancer. It would be easy to think that alcohol caused lung cancer, but it would be wrong.
Ynotisay · M
@curiosi You're cherry picking.
SW-User
@Mikemcneil The more important fact is the lack of having armed personnel ready at the site, because it's legal and accepted, to deter or defeat mass shooters. The gun control mob can't seem to stomach that easy to identify factor.
Arrow17 · 46-50, F
@Waymore @Waymore @WaymoreI hope Covid19 kills those guns supporters.
luv2fish · 61-69, M
@Yulianna Thank you. People need to understand that everything that may be right for one individual may not be suitable for the next person. We need more understanding of people's backgrounds and realize we are not all the same.
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Here’s a fun fact: whatever anyone on this board is saying will have zero effect on the lawmakers. You are just wasting your energy. If you are wealthy enough and are allowed to buy guns, good for you. Buy it. If you are a minority, Muslim, not rich enough, legal immigrant, a woman, have kids, in short, incapable of defending ourself because of a lack of a firearm, all we can do it pray. If you have not seen your neighbor threaten your dad with a shotgun and you cried for two straight days, you don’t know what I am talking about.
@St0ut legal immigrants can’t have it. This right is reserved for citizens only.
St0ut · 51-55, M
@Texanfire no. That’s not true
@St0ut it is. Our neighbor is a permanent resident and they couldn’t get a gun even after their house got robbed.
callis40 · 41-45, M
i saw a news report of a 11 year old american girl in court with a loaded AR15 assault rifle. he dad said guns are for protection.......sorry but at 11 she should be living her life and growing up and worrying about being a child/teen.
pedrohedgerow · 61-69, M
You are not an idiot.What you talk of here is very relevent to what is happening both here in the UK and USA,and I can say this because I have experience of it.Truth,not empty words.Respect to you ✌️
SW-User
I know you are all happy over there with all the shootings of children and killings but over here we tend to like it more peaceful.
SW-User
You better believe it! They certainly will.
SW-User
Mass Shootings are really going well aren't they ?
Tiusflow · 61-69, M
A well reasoned analysis.
antonioio · 70-79, M
Did you ever think of looking at the country's who outlaw guns and how many people get shot their per head of population
antonioio · 70-79, M
@curiosi Thats where the guns have being banned, eventually those numbers will go down as the guns are removed that are already out their and what about the EU? where the guns were never allowed and you still did not answer my question
2cool4school · 46-50, F
@antonioio eventually!?!? It’s been more than 24 years since the buy back in 1996. When exactly do you predict they’ll drop ??
2cool4school · 46-50, F
@antonioio guns never allowed in the eu ?? I don’t think I know of an eu country that never allowed guns. Do enlighten. Iceland is the only country I know of that allows guns yet has no homicide.
Serkan · 61-69, M
Serkan · 61-69, M
for this you areallright in belgium only bad peoples terrorist and so have gun honest peoples no
If abortion is outlawed, only outlaws will have abortions.
Yulianna · 22-25, F
@LeopoldBloom absolutely
htoad34 · 36-40, M
[youtube=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJ_el9c_WNM]

Skip to 1:44 mark. Bit more comical than the actual topic at hand, but still relevant.
St0ut · 51-55, M
Might want to look at my post on this

 
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