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Is there any burden of proof on atheists to disprove the existence of a god? [Spirituality & Religion]

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@AgapeLove Very well stated 👏
whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
Not at all. I fact you may have stumbled on the nexus of science V Religion. In terms of Language we have heat and cold. But in fact, there is only heat and degrees of heat. "Cold" as a scientific term doesnt exist. It is just a complete lack of heat, at absolute zero.
Similarly, a Vacuum in space is a complete absence of matter. A nothing. In both cases we feel the need to give this "nothing" a name and treat it as real. So it is with God. Scientists can demonstrate where God isnt, because other things are there. And the space where God can hide is getting smaller every year.
@whowasthatmaskedman Right - and thank you for acknowledging the existence of God or a force. I mean 2000 years ago they knew about heat but they did not say it was an energetic force.
whowasthatmaskedman · 70-79, M
@MarmeeMarch Yes. Science has pushed God back out of floods, fires, lightening, Eclipses and a whole heap of stuff those ignorant peasants didnt understand. There are still more ignorant peasants out there though.
@whowasthatmaskedman got that right
BatRinseRepeat · 31-35, F
Yes.

And if they can't they will burn forever.

Because God is love.
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@BatRinseRepeat "you always hurt the one you love..m"
PikachuTrainer · 26-30, M
No there is no burden of proof for us to disprove the existence of God, it is upto the Theists to prove its existence.
suzie1960 · 61-69, F
No more than a burden of proof on non-SantaClausians to disprove the existence of Santa Claus, or on non-Pastafarians to disprove the existence of The Flying Spaghetti Monster.
SW-User
Short answer; no.

The reason being, we can’t accept every claim as true, otherwise we’d end up believing in contradictory claims (i.e. Islam and Christianity cannot both be true since they hold contradictory doctrines and ethical codes), so there has to be a “buffer” if you like, a way for us to determine what’s true and what’s not true. Usually, that’s via the application of the scientific method, logic and reason.

If someone proposes “a God exists”, you can either accept it as true (theism) or reject it (atheism). It’s up to those who accept the proposition as true to prove it.

An easier way to demonstrate this is through the court analogy: we don’t assess innocence in court, we assess guilt. If someone claims you’re guilty of a crime, it is for the prosecution to demonstrate this, it’s not for you to demonstrate your innocence.

The burden is on the prosecution to prove their claim that you are guilty; the burden is on theists to prove their claim a God exists.

There’s a lot more to it, so I’d suggest reading up on Matt Dillahunty’s Court Analogy if you’d like to know more.
Whether god exists or not is of no consequence to me. I have no functional use for a supreme being.
zork0000 · 56-60, M
@HungJury especially one that allows harm to innocent children and animals
BlueVeins · 22-25
Only on gnostic ones.
@BlueVeins

Show me a gnostic atheist and i'll show you an idiot lol
SW-User
I sent him a subpoena, he never showed up to testify. Therefore, he does not exist. Next case.
redredred · M
It isnt fair ir logical to require proof of something that is not obviously apparent. It is the burden of the claimant to prove an extraordinary claim. You might claim to have invisible twelve foot wings. Its not my job to prove you don't
SW-User
suzie1960 · 61-69, F
Looks like @PrivatePeeks has blocked me. Oh well, another one bites the dust. :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rY0WxgSXdEE
OggggO · 36-40, M
@suzie1960 And now me as well.
suzie1960 · 61-69, F
@OggggO LOL, and you're a Christian too. :)
OggggO · 36-40, M
@suzie1960 I'm willing to venture that they didn't believe me, or thought I was "the wrong sort" or Christian.
SW-User
No. That would be like expecting someone who doesn’t believe in Santa to disprove that. Lack of an explanation doesn’t equate to an explanation.
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SW-User
Only if they want Easter and Christmas off from work.
Absence of evidence isn't evidence of absence.
@CopperCicada

Well not sure i agree but thanks for the discussion.
@Pikachu Another approach.

Does as CSI (crime scene investigator) ever submit an empty baggie into evidence?
No ... the null hypothesis does not have to be proved.
Heney · 18-21, F
Mm not really, in general when debating something’s existence the burden of proof is on proving it does exist as proving something doesn’t exist is practically impossible. Anything [i]could[/i] exist
suzie1960 · 61-69, F
@Heney Exactly, as the example of Russell's Teapot shows.
Rokasu · 36-40, M
Easy. Fairies aren’t real hence god isn’t real.

But gnomes... that’s a whole different story.
suzie1960 · 61-69, F
@Rokasu It's a thought experiment, the cat might be alive or it might be dead. Its state can't be determined until it's observed, which fixes its state. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schr%C3%B6dinger%27s_cat
Rokasu · 36-40, M
@suzie1960 I knew about the cat but you said moggy. My American is too handicapped for all this word exchange.
suzie1960 · 61-69, F
@Rokasu Sorry, moggy (or mog) is just UK slang for cat. I forget that English is not everyone's first language. :(
hippyjoe1955 · 61-69, M
Atheists simply deny the evidence. Not very bright of them but a constant out for them.
zork0000 · 56-60, M
@hippyjoe1955 With proper spelling and punctuation, I might have some inkling of what you are trying to say.

So-called idiots are writing clear and concise responses and questions to you and this is the best you have?
OggggO · 36-40, M
@hippyjoe1955 [quote]I don't hate anyone.[/quote]

Hoo boy, now that's a lie.
newjaninev2 · 56-60, F
@hippyjoe1955 [quote]It has multiple interpretations[/quote]

The evidence doesn't require an interpretation.

The evidence requires an explanation
Picklebobble2 · 56-60, M
And how do you suggest folk prove the non-existence of something when you can't prove the opposite ?
@Picklebobble2

Seems like it would be hard
SW-User
It sounds like a lot of work ....live and let live
@SW-User

It would certainly be awfully hard
SW-User
I don't have that kind of time or energy @Pikachu
@SW-User

I hear ya lol
OggggO · 36-40, M
Generally the burden is to disprove the null hypothesis, not prove it.
@OggggO

I'm glad you mentioned the null hypothesis. I wish more theists would familiarize themselves with it
TheConstantGardener · 56-60, M
It's a matter of faith. No burden at all.
nowic2 · 61-69, M
No but nor is there any obligation on the god bothers to prove their case either. Regardless of what others think, we all have our beliefs. Live & let live, respectfully.
@nowic2

What if they're trying to convince you that their god is real?
nowic2 · 61-69, M
@Pikachu not your problem, ignore!
SW-User
Ok..I think I might be slightly confused by this question. What exactly did you ask? I guess the "burden of proof" part is what throws me off. :)
@SW-User

So it could be said that someone claiming that god exists has a burden to prove that god exists if he wants us to accept that claim. This goes for any claim.

In the god debate, a theist will often claim that an atheist must prove that god does NOT exist or else the theist's claim remains valid.
SW-User
Oh. Then the answer is still no to me. Since I personally feel neither side to this has any factual proof that can be seen or denied with the naked eye, then there shouldn't be any burden, obligation or duty to prove or disprove...especially if neither side is open to that prospect which is usually the case. Like you said..It goes for any claim.

Just the way I see it.
MasterDvdC · 61-69, M
For those who don't believe no proof is possible. For those who believe no proof is necessary.
OggggO · 36-40, M
@MasterDvdC Excellent fortune cookie, bad philosophy.
@MasterDvdC

[quote]For those who don't believe no proof is possible[/quote]

Nah. It's a cute turn of phrase but it's not really accurate.
God comes down and does his god thing, i'll believe.

Anyway, you haven't answered the question
zork0000 · 56-60, M
@MasterDvdC Proof should always be necessary whether you believe in something or not.
TheWildEcho · 56-60, M
Refloating the Titanic would be easier than disproving God
TheWildEcho · 56-60, M
@suzie1960 why would anyone want to?
suzie1960 · 61-69, F
@TheWildEcho Some people seem to think Santa Claus isn't real. They even tell their children that yet there's no proof He isn't.

It's the same with The Flying Spaghetti Monster.
TheWildEcho · 56-60, M
@suzie1960 if you say so Suzie
Thanos · 31-35, M
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suzie1960 · 61-69, F
@SW-User She blocked me too. She's not the brightest bulb on the tree. ;)
SW-User
In what sense?
@SW-User

presumably to people who a) believe in a god and b) think an atheist has a burden of proof for not believing the same.
SW-User
@Pikachu Why would you need to explain yourself to them?
@SW-User

I wouldn't [i]need[/i] to do anything😉
pentacorn · F
disprove to whom?
@pentacorn

presumably people who a) believe in a god and b) think an atheist has a burden of proof for not believing the same.
pentacorn · F
@Pikachu that’s their problem. the burden belongs to people who a) and b)
@pentacorn


i would agree
Here we go 🍿🕶️🥤
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Prove to me the existence of heat without measuring instruments. Just explain it to me using words.
suzie1960 · 61-69, F
The point is, you should prove that heat doesn't exist.
@MarmeeMarch

Why without instruments?


I mean, i assume you're trying to make a point. Let's just skip to that part.
newjaninev2 · 56-60, F
@MarmeeMarch Wasn't that already done on a different post? Why, [i]having failed to respond to that,[/i] are you now repeating the same request on this post?

Actually, it's quite endearing. You're prohibiting the use of dermal thermoreceptors, chromatic vision, and auditory senses... in short, you're asking how a rock would demonstrate to itself that heat exists.
DDonde · 31-35, M
You already know the answer to this. 😒
DDonde · 31-35, M
@Rokasu Internet Explorer [i]bait[/i]
Whatever that would mean lol
Rokasu · 36-40, M
@DDonde Don’t day it [i]twice[/i]. I’m disgusted. You better be bottom tonight or else I’m breaking that ass tomorrow.
Rokasu · 36-40, M
@DDonde Breakinf up with*
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@LvChris

Oh i see what you're saying. Well i was asking this question with the intent to have a discussion/debate with anyone who felt that the answer was yes but "trap" seems too sneaky and trollish lol.


I prefer to call it an invitation to a discussion.
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@LvChris

It could very possibly be quite a short discussion lol
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@PrivatePeeks

So what kind of atheists need to prove that their belief is correct and where does it being an advantageous belief enter into it?
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@PrivatePeeks

So i say to a theist: "your evidence that such a thing as a god exists is unconvincing and therefore i do not believe such a thing as a god exists."

Why do i need to prove that i'm correct?

[quote]And advantage always accompanies correctness.[/quote]

I'm gonna need you to explain that statement in the context of this question.

 
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