I am a theist, ask me anything [Spirituality & Religion]

@VoloProVeritas62

No, I do not accept Jesus as my Lord and Savior, though I do hold a level of respect those that do.

@TheMorningsStar What do you study then?

@VoloProVeritas62

Study? As in?

@TheMorningsStar The Word of God?

I read various ancient texts and "study" them, from the Bible, the Qur'an, apocrypha works from each, texts from Ancient Greece, Ancient Rome, etc.

@VoloProVeritas62 Do you believe the Word of God to be the truth?

If what you mean by "Word of God" is the Bible, then not entirely, no. There are some things one can learn by reading the Bible, but it is not entirely true, and such a thing would also be impossible as it contradicts itself in places. This doesn't mean one cannot find value within the text, nor does it mean there is not some truth to the text, just that it is not entirely true nor does it even get close to addressing all that is out there.

@TheMorningsStar Can you give me an example of contradiction in the Bible?

Did Jesus abolish the Law or not?

@TheMorningsStar What did Jesus say in Matthew 5:17?

Exactly my point though. In Matthew (a Gospel which, if you look at history, falls more along the "Peterine" school of thought) clearly makes it seem as if the Law is still in effect. You point out Matthew 5:17, but look at Matthew 5:18 for a MUCH CLEARER point that was trying to be made:

"For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth pass away, not one letter, not one stroke of a letter, will pass from the law until all is accomplished."

Heaven and Earth are still here. In fact, if you look at any document that falls more along the "Peterine" school of thought you will see clear statements that indicate or outright say the Law is still in effect.

But look towards the Pauline school of thought and you will find the view that the Law is no longer in effect. For example, Ephesians 2:14-15:

"For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;"

Even if you look at Paul's letters and other early Christian writings you can clearly see that Paul and Peter fought quite a bit, that they didn't agree on things. Peter said that one had to be circumcised to become a Christian (and this is reflected in some of the Christian writings that come from the "Peterine" school of thought), Paul said that was not a true requirement (reflected in his writings and writings of the "Pauline" school of thought).

(Religious Studies Major with a focus on historical studies)

@TheMorningsStar If you read Matthew 5:17 you would've read that Jesus didn't come to destroy the law but to fulfill it. You're missing the whole point of why He came. You're looking at this from a religious point of view instead of God's point of view. Jesus came that we may have life and life more abundantly. He took our sins and nailed them to the cross by allowing Himself to be nailed to that cross and after three days He rose again to defeat death. This was all God's plan of reconciling us to Himself that we may no longer be under the weight of the law. Anyone who receives Christ as Lord and Savior is no longer under law that was written on tablets but on their hearts. In the beginning we gave our identities that God created in us from that time but Jesus got our identities back to give to us once more. God is bring mankind full circle.

Except that isn't what Matthew 5:17 actually means based on how it is written in the original Greek. Literally, the only reason that interpretation exists on the level it does today is that translations have caused some of the meaning to disappear. Furthermore, there are COUNTLESS examples of contradictions within the Bible, this was just one example which is even indirectly admitted in the Bible. Paul writes about conflicts he has with Cephas/Peter, we even see mentions of this in non-canonical works from the period. Whenever we see a work that focuses on ideas Peter mostly talked about we also see mentions of the Law being in effect. When we see works that focus on ideas Paul mostly talked about we see mentions of the Law no linger being applicable.

Honestly, I can't think of even a single reputable scholar in the field that disagrees with this either. Hell, even a lot of pastors and priests, when you sit down and talk to them about HISTORY instead of theology, have even admitted as such.

I do find it funny that the "Born Again Christian" ideology (and many sub-ideologies from the movement) is actually a very new thing (one or two hundred years) and found almost only in America.

@TheMorningsStar Jesus said in John 3:3 that unless we are born again, no one can see the kingdom of God. 3:5 says that unless we are born of water and the Spirit, we cannot enter the kingdom God. 3:6 says, that which is born of flesh is flesh and that which is born of Spirit is spirit. In other words, you had a physical birth, now you need a Spiritual birth in order to know the Word of God and God Himself. Without the Spirit of God dwelling in you, you're never going to accurately interpret His Word. There's only one interpretation of the Bible, if you will, and that belongs to God Himself, not man.

And this is ultimately the flaw of the Born Again movement compared to earlier Christian movements. When pushed into a corner it has become practice to say that you need to become "born again" in order to PROPERLY understand the Bible (aka, you need to believe already in order to find the Bible consistent enough for belief). For CENTURIES before this point the Christian movement acknowledged that the Bible contained its flaws but still managed to convince people of Christianity despite that, even during and after the Enlightenment.

@TheMorningsStar It's not me that says it, it's the Word of God. There are religious people out there that claim to be Christian when in reality, they are ravenous wolves in sheep's clothing. There true believers in Christ that are not ravenous wolves that lovers of God and lovers of His Word. Don't take my word for it, look it up.